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Are we killing our own sport?
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Posted by: Blackcat---------------------

Sell the .45 and buy a bike.

Posted by: skyhigh230---------------------

i dont know about you but a 2 stroke kills my ears alot more than the 4 strokes do their both loud but a 2 stroke is buzzie its annoying sounding and what it puts out dont smell to good either i agree 4 stokes are louder farther away but if youve ever been to a mainly 2 stroke race after the start the fumes leave you choking for air

Posted by: skyhigh230---------------------

makes me want to go get something to make my bike quiet

Posted by: CR fella---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by zaz696

Quiet silencers won't help this idiot. I don't care if you have a 50 cal sniper rifle at your side. You will shoot someone, then spend the rest of your life in prison regretting the stupid act. Also, I'm sure the other riders you can't shoot will find a good place for your "45" (where the sun don't shine). If you need a side arm to deal with a bunch of kids riding dirt bikes, you are a wuss, an idiot or both.

lol shoot a rider and the only noise you'll hear will be your own screams commin from big bubbas cell as he rips you a new one

guns don't do ****, they only make people go out and get their own and then come pay you a visit, and if it's not illegal in your state then im sure their not that hard to come by, and running around making it visible to everyone is by far the stuidest thing anyone can do, god i'd be getting a gun just to keep the crazy neighbour at bay.

Posted by: b-rocker---------------------

Our sport is very driven by what's cool.Pipes,gear,etc.If the manufacturers would
get together and put all the top riders on quiet bikes, the aftermarket could still sell the pipes that the pros have and maybe we can stand next to the track and talk
to each other.I'm 47 now and want somewhere to ride when I'm 67. I think the
AMA and promotors aren't thinking beyond today.

Posted by: cteteacher---------------------

I am new to the sport again. I rode when I was in High school and sold my bike for a street bike. Sold the street bike for a killer stereo

Sold the car and stereo. No I am a married man with a little girl who I can't wait to get old enough to ride. I am also a Parole Officer so I run into crazy people doing crazy stuff all the time. I ride at an OHV park in a a national recreational area. I ride a 06 TTR-230 that is completely stock. I don't think it is loud at all, but I could be wrong. What I hate is when I am coming back to the staging area I see these guys on both quads and bikes that are going the required 5mph and are ten times louder than my bike at wide open throttle. My point is I can understand a bike getting loud when you are really on it, but what is the point of having a loud bike when you are putting along. I will also say that it is both the 2 and 4 strokes that get on my nerves. Sure let the bike rip when it is wide open, but you aren't making any power cruising at 5mph so why be loud? I hate hearing bikes on the other side of the park through dense woods. I always wonder what they are doing and then I see them pull out and they are just coasting along being loud. I am all for quiet bikes. Oh and as far as the sound level in domes I don't really get it. I went to the St. Louis SX race and even my wife didn't complain about the loud noise. I am definately glad it was mostly four strokes though because I hate going to our local expo center and coming out smelling like gas. Just my 2 cents though. I will gladly support anything that improves the sport. And just a heads up, but the guys that offroad in trucks are fighting the same battle so maybe we need to team up with them. After all we share a lot of the same land.

Posted by: Mini Rider #4---------------------

Check this out!

In Virginia, House Bill 3073 would make it illegal for anyone to ride a dirtbike or ATV within 500 feet of any home, including their own!

I Washington, Senate Bill 5544 and House Bill 1434 would make it illegal to ride a dirtbike or ATV anywhere where the sound is audible inside, or immediately adjacent to, a residence.

Courtesy of: American Motorcyclist ( April 2007 )

Posted by: olderndirtmom---------------------

Wow. A Highly Educational Thread, to say the least.

Is there some way to condense this down to some salient "Here's what you can do" thread of the productive recommendations?

(Some suggestions would be to include links to a website with addresses of manufacturers, AMA contacts, the dirtbike lobby, the mx lobby, the general roadbike lobby? and maybe lock it from future discussion so it maintains its usefulness?)

For educational purposes, I'd also vote to keep the two summaries that are found on this and one other thread regarding the physics of exhaust systems, power, and sound. Maybe on a second thread or, again, in a website?

Posted by: lynch racing---------------------

As long as you keep buying the 4t they will make them, Don`t buy them! We run a KTM 144 and sound test every tech inspection at 93db with a FMF shorty! Half the maintainence cost and runs over the 250F`s. They added a 125 2T sub class in the EM this year and a resurgence of the 2 stroke has started over here, many teams switching back and will make the 125 2t class the contested class with more money available to field more riders and more exposure for the teams, It`ll start in the USA soon as you are always a season behind,,,

Posted by: motoxracr---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by skyhigh230

i dont know about you but a 2 stroke kills my ears alot more than the 4 strokes do their both loud but a 2 stroke is buzzie its annoying sounding and what it puts out dont smell to good either i agree 4 stokes are louder farther away but if youve ever been to a mainly 2 stroke race after the start the fumes leave you choking for air

i know its a matter of opinion, but i luv the sound the 2 strokes have. And as far as the smell i luv that too. i like to come home and have all my gear smell like 2 stroke.

Now i know this whole thing was about the sound of the thumpers, but the scream of the 2 stroke is the best sound ever. sometimes if my bike is broke down ill start up the weedeater and do that a while just to listen to that sound lol.

Posted by: Surfrider---------------------

story was great, i wish my buddies would shut their damn thumpers up

Posted by: Surfrider---------------------

in regards to the last 3 topics on noise pollution...I ride a 2 stroke and keep the exhaust quiet on both of my bikes 125 and 250. But then there are my riding buddies and fellow track riders who cannot get the concept of "power doesn't come from noise". I am a mechanic and they still don't listen, i have explained that they just need to properly jet their bikes to put a quiet muffler on, i have explained that fmf makes Q mufflers...but alas these morons show up at the next practice, one has a straght pipe on his 450 and the other guy has one of those shorty silencers on his 2 stroker. These same people also still have the balls to throw up their hands and curse the world because most of upstate NY area has been posted with orange diamonds indicating no motorized vehicles..........i hate loud pipes. If anyone has any suggestions or ideas on how to get through to morons like this, please let me know.

Posted by: 76GMC1500---------------------

The thick skulled morons are also the people who close the trails to motorized vehicles. It doesn't matter how quiet your bike is, they just don't want you to ride it.

Posted by: motometal---------------------

that's a bit of generalizing GMC. So are you saying that no riding areas are closing due to noise?

Posted by: Cman250---------------------

Well as kid myself i can understand why and where all these loud pipes are coming from. As with any competitive sport there are mainly two types of people, "He wants to win" & "He who wants to be noticed". Well for those that just want to be noticed one of the easiest ways for them to make people turn heads towards them selves and get attention is to have a loud pipe. These people who want to be noticed are Hackers of a sort. They want all the fame and glory of being a professional without having to do any of the work. They look for ways in which people will notice them, appaluad them, and try to take after them so they can feel special. Its almost as if theres a competition in the sport just to have the loudest pipe and to be noticed the most. And the youngsters who come to the track for the first time, their first impression is on the loud pipes and they too get mesmerized into this screwed up perseption. Don't get me wrong , not all with a loud pipe just wants to be noticed, but its an advantage, to have more performance and a way to keep up with the competition. I understand this and respect it in a sort that they are trying and strive so hard to win. Well if you ask me these people need to stop working so they can pay for these expensive pipes to be faster and need to start working on their riding skills. We need a way to convince these "punks" that the attention they are getting is not the kind they want.

Posted by: 2-Strokes 4-ever---------------------

Here's how...........blow by em on a quiet bike. I do however, totally understand your point. It's the loud pipe "I'm bad" mentality that also makes the excuses for being passed..........."Sun was in my eyes, bad powerband, alarm clock didn't go off" blah blah, blah.

Posted by: crazymotoxrider---------------------

The article made me think as well,But unfortunatly I can't do much about the sound of my CR250.It is a 1985 and You can only buy so many parts for it.I have a Stock Pipe,And a DG Silencer which I replaced the packing and it didn't do much to the sound.My bike isn't TOO loud,But is alittle louder than my friends CR125 which is newer.I think alot of trails are shut down due to noise,And when I am at the track I am scared to death of them big 4-strokes behind me.It seems they are right behind me so I gun it looking like a idiot just because I think there right behind me,When there on the other side of the track.I do agree people should lessen the noise of their bikes.

Posted by: KTM Mike---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazymotoxrider

...But unfortunatly I can't do much about the sound of my CR250.It is a 1985 and You can only buy so many parts for it.I have a Stock Pipe,And a DG Silencer which I replaced the packing and it didn't do much to the sound...

Crazy - good to know you repacked your silencer - way to many people,particularly those on older bikes it seems, dont bother to. Actually there is a lot you can do with your old CR - do a search on Db Snorkle - great product - really quiets down a bike, does not have a performance impact (and the seller has dyno charts to prove it).

Posted by: big-bro-6---------------------

Hey my buddys got a KX65 2stroke and when he starts it u cant here anything or anyone talking to you atleast take to heart if you get a quite pipe people in your comunitee wont call the cops and hate you people so much so think of what your doing cause soon dirtbiking is going to be accient history. Where I live you see some guy riding a KX250F and he rides for 5 mins and the cop come in the next 10 to see what the noise problem is about cause someone just calls the cops. so think about what your doing.

Posted by: dirtbikermicah---------------------

more editing by PK *************** take the hint and grow up a bit.

Posted by: lynch racing---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by motometal

, but not sure. The headpipe on a modern four stroke will sometimes glow if you ride hard, don't remember the twos doing that but not sure if hotter gasses means louder exhaust.

Steve Lamson`s famous "Blue Pipe" Hondas, He just cooked them-a real 125 rider-Deep mud or sand and he would make them glow if it was dark!!!

Posted by: J-man---------------------

you guys need to think for a second on what u are complaning about anyway. some of u are saying a loud pipe will get the cops to come over, what part of DIRT bike do u not understand. whats wrong with a loud pipe it shows that you are a true offroad rider and love the sport. if u were having problems and the cops are being involved then you are not offroad because they wont bother you if u are. so a loud pipe is not a bad thing at all.

Posted by: sixds---------------------

Quote:

you guys need to think for a second on what u are complaning about anyway. some of u are saying a loud pipe will get the cops to come over, what part of DIRT bike do u not understand. whats wrong with a loud pipe it shows that you are a true offroad rider and love the sport. if u were having problems and the cops are being involved then you are not offroad because they wont bother you if u are. so a loud pipe is not a bad thing at all.

so your saying that loud pipes are none of the reason riding areas are being shut down?

Posted by: flyingfuzzball---------------------

i think that some people just dont like us.

my friends ride a crf150F and a crf100f in their back yard and their neighbor complained. these bikes a quiet too. some people are reistant to change and that fact that our sport is becoming bigger is a big change.

noise is a problem though thats why i run a Q4 cuz the stock 150r pipe is uncorked and loud

but i also think that there needs to be some noise but not a lot. i mean it would just be weird to me to hop on a bike start it up and hum away.

you dont need a lot of noise just a little something. my old bike (the crf100 my friends little bro rides) made just the right amount. it wasnt loud but it didnt hum.

and i hope no one reads that and says oh this guy wants bikes to be loud. if i did why would i have gone a bought an expensive Q4.

Posted by: 2-Strokes 4-ever---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by J-man

Come on now, come straight with us.........we recognize a quad rider when we hear one.

Posted by: just_a_rider---------------------

I would love to make my bikes quieter but no to the point of running a spark arresting silencer when I don't do trails.

Posted by: flyingfuzzball---------------------

whats wrong with a spark arrestor?

Posted by: just_a_rider---------------------

I had one on my 85 KX125 back in the 80's and it was on it when I bought it used. I replaced the silencer with the one that was supposed to be on it after a wheelie went bad and bent it 90 degrees, there was a noticable dif in the quickness of throttle responce and pull, maybe it was just me but I swear their was a dif.

Posted by: ep1k---------------------

What are thumpers

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by ep1k

What are thumpers

four strokes.

Posted by: ep1k---------------------

Sweet thanks. Do you know why they are called thumpers

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

because of their low, thumping tone.

Posted by: peanuts---------------------

Does this mean I should put the baffle back in my xr250? Geeze I only took it out last night. Wish I'd read this yesterday afternoon. I hate sensible ideas. They always make me feel dumb.

Posted by: M.Mothershead---------------------

I dont't care what anyone says, but I like the noise. If there was no loud exhaust, there wouldn't be as much excitement. Plus, men tend to like the sport and most men like big, loud machines racing around flying through the air, but if there was no exhaust I think it would be kinda boring. And if you dont like the noise, they make a thing called ear plugs, and they work.

Posted by: Rich Rohrich---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by M.Mothershead

And if you dont like the noise, they make a thing called ear plugs, and they work.

Shouldn't you be heading off to your Mensa meeting about now?

Posted by: M.Mothershead---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Rohrich

Shouldn't you be heading off to your Mensa meeting about now?

That makes no sense. Do you even know what Mensa is?

Posted by: 2-Strokes 4-ever---------------------

Mensa: Top 2% IQ.
I am not the sharpest tool in the shed, but I know my loud bike works towards losing riding privileges for me AND my fellow riders...........ummm, I think

Posted by: Rich Rohrich---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by M.Mothershead

That makes no sense. Do you even know what Mensa is?

ironic

adjective
1. humorously sarcastic or mocking;

2. characterized by often poignant difference or incongruity between what is expected and what actually is;

Posted by: M.Mothershead---------------------

What do you mean by "riding priveledges"?

Posted by: M.Mothershead---------------------

I didn't mean to cause such a problem..I was simply providing my opinion.

Posted by: bloodorange---------------------

I just replaced a hollowed out silencer (packing was removed) for a Pro circ 296 silencer on the bike I just bought.

I lost a tiny bit off the low end but made up for it by (ETA-meant increase) dropping 2 teeth on the front spkt. Even before the sprocket change i noticed a lot more punch in the mid that carries through the top end.

I'll take that over the noise anyday, plus the stealth factor. Being able to take it to a field down the street that's near a neighborhood and office park for quick testing of tweaks and repairs is priceless.

Holding a conversation with another rider without having to shut it off is nice too. Not getting dirty looks from others in the camping/staging areas is also nice.

Posted by: Chris in Denver---------------------

Yes, put it back on.

Posted by: stayfly3327---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by M.Mothershead

I didn't mean to cause such a problem..I was simply providing my opinion.

but your opinion made no sence
you think that everyone that comes near dirtbikes that think there to loud should put a ear plugs in
thata good idea but the plain and simple truth is most people are assholes and when theres something thats bothering them theyll tryin and stop it from happening ever again
beleive me i kno from expeirence (neighbors dont like my freinds or my music and mostly kids in general but i also live in a neigborhood with probably about 80% elderly people)
and i also must say that kids these days love attension and i know plenty of kids who buy new quads and the first thing they do with them is take off the silencers and just make them sound loud and obnoxious

Posted by: DieselTech---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by M.Mothershead

What do you mean by "riding priveledges"?

Well, believe it or not, being permitted to ride ANYWHERE (including your OWN property) is a PRIVILEGE. You see, you don't actually own your property - the government does, and you own an INTEREST in it. That's how things such as zoning laws control what can be done and where. If you don't believe me, just go to your town and read the zoning regs.......

Our bikes CAN be made quieter, but right now, quiet isn't PROFITABLE. "Cool" is. "Fast" is. "More power" is.

I don't care what kind of vehicle it is - MX bike, learjet, lawnmower, Harley, crotch-rocket, drag car, speedboat, or whatever - loud is not cool. The funny thing is, some types of motorized sports noise is more accepted than others (drag racing, NASCAR, speedboats come to mind), and even noise created by non-motorized sports or activities (gun range, outdoor concerts) - why is that? I think part of it has to do with a perception that motorcyclists (dirt or street) are "bad boys" - similar to the perception that a mechanic is a "grease monkey" - both of which are negative perceptions, and neither of which is true.

Okie (and others) are 100% right - we (the riders) need to try to make our bikes quiet enough that the general public won't be bothered by the noise. If we try to educate fellow riders, as well as Joe Q. Public, we can make it happen and preserve our sport.
It starts with us - WE buy the bikes, the pipes, the silencers, etc. The builders (OEM's, Exhaust, etc.) build what sells - i.e., what is profitable. As long as someone is buying the stuff, they'll keep selling it. Well, unless either the government or race promoters/sanctioning bodies require noise standards, but I don't think the answer is mandatory regulation. It may come to that. It did in Europe.

Posted by: Chris in Denver---------------------

"They" don't like "us" because "they" are the mothers and fathers who told "us" we couldn't ride because the bikes are dangerous. Bottom line, the haters are people who just hate motorcycle. Noise is just their outlet to ban a sport "they" don't like becaie "they" perceive it as dangerous.

Posted by: iamdawalru5---------------------

I have known of this article for some months now, maybe even a year. I have always had it in mind from the time I read it, the idea that noise is bad. I just picked up my kx250 with the stock pipe, but with an fmf powercore2 silencer. I don't know how this exhaust compares in noise to the stock silencer because the guy I got it from didn't have it to give to me. Any thoughts? I know its pretty loud, not as loud as new fourstrokes or debaffled motorcycles anyway but we're barely skidding by on being able to use a local land owner's property. Last year the big complaint in this particular person's eyes, or as I should say ears was the noise we were making.

Is the powercore 2 too loud? This motorcycle has serious grunt that I have never had in a 2 stroke before and would hate to see it go, but Id rather not get kicked off someones land for noise reasons again. Thanks

Alex

Posted by: misfitfmx---------------------

My YZ250F has a Powercore IV on it right now, I'm sure I'll start getting some noise complaints soon.

Posted by: uh_oh---------------------

IMHO opinion, they wont be happy till we arent riding no matter what.

Posted by: olderndirtmom---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by misfitfmx

My YZ250F has a Powercore IV on it right now, I'm sure I'll start getting some noise complaints soon.

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamdawalru5

.Is the powercore 2 too loud? Alex

You can pick up a sound decibel reader for $25-$30. Seems the most rational way to approach the issue.

Posted by: White_Wolf---------------------

Noise I can not stand it. I mean on a truck maybe but not a dirtbike. I think quitter the better. Why would you want a loud dirt bike while riding plus would annoy me after awhile. I enjoy riding with friends and through the woods to look. It would suck to have to turn my dirtbike off ever time just to talk to my friend. Plus I love watching animals in the wild. Loud pipes would scare them all off. Just my opinion

Posted by: medcalfj---------------------

I know this doesnt really go along with the whole topic at hand but I just do not understand the whole hype with 4 strokes all of a sudden, I mean several years ago if you brought a 4-stroke to the track you'd probably get laughed off. Now I have been out of the moto scene for awhile and am just now getting back in it but, of the few tracks I have been to recently everyone is running 4 strokes. I understand that 4 strokes are more economical as far as pollution but to me its not the same. Mfgs still produce 2 strokes so why the drastic change in people buying them?

Posted by: O3RM125---------------------

I skimed thru most of this topic, I dont have time to read everything here, I do agree that noise is an issue and the bikes could probably be quieter.

I wanted to add one thing though- What are the loudest and most common bike you come across on a daily basis? Well for me and many others its not even a dirt bike, not even made to be ridden in obscure, lonely areas, but it is in-fact a Harley. They are everywhere, they have no sound limit(by law, here in my state anyway)and can be legally street-driven and are wayy louder than any off-road bike I have ever heard.

When the Harleys start to quiet down, so they are not blasting my ear drums out at a light when taking off when my windows are down, maybe Ill consider it too on my OFF-ROAD bike.

Posted by: 2-Strokes 4-ever---------------------

However, a Harley rides by, and is gone. When on the trail or track, we WILL bother others because we are often (many of us) in the same area all day. So if the Harley rider is offensive... then we have a right to be too?

Posted by: O3RM125---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2-Strokes 4-ever

However, a Harley rides by, and is gone. When on the trail or track, we WILL bother others because we are often (many of us) in the same area all day. So if the Harley rider is offensive... then we have a right to be too?

That is an assumption that I would be riding my "loud" bike in one spot all day.. and not "moving on" down the road.. And you can hear a loud Harley from a whole lot further away, but thats not what my point was, I was only trying to say that these are street legal vehicles that everyone encounters daily and yet they have NO noise limitations. Even my car cant be that loud in my state. Also, Harleys tend to travel in packs(sometimes just 2-3, but sometimes many more!) as well, if youve never seen such, then I throw my hands up now and give up!

If riding trails and you dont start out away from houses then you should at some time be away from them, unless the "trail" is around your own house.. that is just simple common sense, I learned that at like 12 after getting salt rock shot at me for riding near someones home all day. When I was real young a kid was riding his bike up and down a road in a desert campground(Mobiland) we used to go to alot, a man came out and asked the boy if he had another sparkplug, the boy replied "no" and the man used a cresent wrench to break off the tip of the plug that was in the running engine.

When I think of trails I think more of fire-roads that are out in the middle of nowhere, if your riding near a large housing area thats not exactly the smartest thing in the first place, and in doing so your "being" exactly what those who dont ride bikes or own them dont want to hear or see..

Track: I think its obvious that a Track should be out and away from Homes, this really is a no brainer. If the land owner has homes nearby he shouldnt have built a track there(more common sense).

I dont think anyone should have the "right" to be offensive, but I sure would appreciate equal restrictions on noise. And it is no secret that Harley bikes can be very offensive, and I dont think I even need to go into all that... One could say since they have no limitation on noise that they indeed do have the right to be offensive! Depends on how ya wanna look at it I guess..

I know the bikes are loud and I understand the effect that has overall, and I guess what gets me is that our sport can be "picked on" while a Harley rider can go where he/she wants in areas where population is thick and be as loud as they wish.

edit: If you want quiet I could recommend a drz110, mine is about as loud as a lawnmower, when I take it out from my garage to the hills near my home my wife doesnt even hear me come or go. I dont ride my RM around my home at all, even though it would be totally legal for me to do so here, I dont because of how loud it is.

Posted by: PlowboysGhost---------------------

I, too, have been out of the racing scene for awhile and am scatching my head at the near universal change to 4-strokes now that I'm paying attention again. It seems a process of regression. Then again I don't personally like 4-stroke power any more than I like loud bikes or the idea of $1000+ top-end rebuilds, so just label me a dinosaur

I guess I have nothing new to add so I'll just go ride my KX(with quiet spark arrestor Answer silencer) till dark, then log in to "Two Stroke Militia" when I get back with the aroma of racing castor still in my head.

Posted by: warrior91---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2-Strokes 4-ever

Come on now, come straight with us.........we recognize a quad rider when we hear one.

Yeah and asshats should look for comonality in the OHV community.
Most "intrest groups" lump quads and dirtbikes together...
It is only eletist snobs that separate the 2 and think they are different or better.

Just like skiers bitching about snowboarders ruining the mountian.

2 stroke or four stroke...your motor is no different than any ATV riders...
Are the 2-wheelers not interested in keeping "their" sport...You will need all OHV groups speaking as one....and the way you speak does not foster this at all...
All motor sports need to work together.

It must suck to have to ride the same track or trail outside of town or in an industrial park. Boring .....I can ride all day without seeing or bothering anyone...Not on the same trail twice.Noise is no issue here as there is no population to hear it.
I am still willing to help all ohv keep the sport...even if it has NO bearing on my family,friends or aquaintance...Some day I might want to hit some "big name" dunes and would love to b e able to ride them on MX or quad...Not just view the dunes because the are closed to riding.

An us VS them mentality does no good . You can't have infighting and still overcome the "ANTI-FUN" interest groups.

I'll prob. get flamed for this...but I wouldn't expect any less from some posters.

Posted by: atkkid250---------------------

yesss, i am a young lad myself, and people were fine with us riding around, even encouraged in my rural town until a couple months agoe when my friend just bought a new pipe for his crf450, loudest thing ever, and now the people we used to get compliments from are yelling at us, ppl, lets be more like "wolf" here and respect teh people ears,. And personally i like the 2 strokes, pinger for life!

Posted by: Dirty Dave---------------------

That was a great article. I am embarrassed that I just found it. Noise has been an issue with me for along time. I ride Hollister hills alot and a friend of mine lives very near park. He said when he first moved in several years ago, he could only hear the park when the wind was blowing from the south. Now that the attendance has increased and the majority of bikes are 4 stroke he can hear the park every weekend and most mid-week days. I can tell you for a fact that noise has been a major factor in the delay to expansion of the park's boundaries. We as green/red sticker riders have owned several hundred acres of new riding area around the current fence line for several years but the locals have thrown up legal road blocks of any type they can think of to keep the trails from getting closer to their property. During Thanksgiving we camped near Elkins Flat. I figure about 30-40% of the bikes were red sticker and 50-60% of those had race pipes on.

Nuff said... Thanks again for posting that article.

Posted by: Coop---------------------

All I know is when I used to drive up the road to local track on Friday nights you couldn't really hear the bikes until you were almost at the gate. Now 1/2 mile down the road you can hear the roar of the 4 strokes. I wonder every time how long until local citizens have the track closed due to noise violations.

Posted by: sensei---------------------

I imagine I'll run my exhaust stock for awhile...

Posted by: wake_rider---------------------

I run the FMF TurbineCore II silencer with a FMF Fatty pipe and it seems to be pretty good. I'll say that it is definitely WAY quieter than my two buddies kx250's that are both running full Pro Circuit systems on them.

I agree with the sound issue. All the time I'm aggravated with these kids on quad 450F's with big gun exhausts. Not just the noise, but the attitude of the people on them. They are the kind of people that ride w/o helmets, going the wrong direction down directional trails, drinking in the parking lots, and just causing issues. They all seem to have this "hick" mentality that they can do whatever they want and "F-U" to anyone who says otherwise. All the while, their children are sitting there watching and beginning to emulate their attitude and actions... It becomes an ongoing cycle.

Posted by: 2-Strokes 4-ever---------------------

It seems (based on my experience) that once a quad customer signs on the dotted line his brains get sucked right out. The shame of it is, to the general public we're all grouped right in there as "ORV"ers).

Posted by: wake_rider---------------------

Yeah. I know a good amount of responsible quad riders, but I know waayyy more that aren't. To ride a quad decently it just doesn't take the skill that a bike does. I'm not saying that pro riders aren't skilled, because they most definitely are, but you can take a quad out with no experience and over a weekend be able to keep up with the majority of the other riders. It's just not the same with bikes. There is a huge learning curve from one level to the next on bikes that you just don't have on a quad. Since that is the case, you see every Jim Bob jumping on a quad and immediately thinking they are a good rider, when in all actuality it's just a whole lot easier to keep up without experience when you are on a quad.

Now that I got way off subject, the problem is that you get these guys that just want to feel manly so they buy quads and put the loudest exhaust they possibly can in order to draw attention. These same people are the people that tear around the parking lots without helmets popping wheelies and run into someone and get someone hurt. They are also the same people that run reverse on directional trails because they don't know better and end up running head on into someone doing everything right (I can't tell you how many times this has happened to me, and EVERY SINGLE TIME it has been someone on a quad that was going the wrong way) then someone gets injured or killed. When that happens it causes a public uproar and our riding areas get shut down, again because of ignorance. What they don't realize is the harm that they are doing to the public perception of the sport and they are causing people that would normally have a neutral opinion about it into people that turn active in the push to shut it down in their area. When you call them out on it, they just don't care because they haven't been around the sport long enough to see how much we have lost due to ignorance amongst both the participants and the outsiders.

Posted by: sonnysair6---------------------

First of i Do NOT mind the Noise, but i can see why some people do, especially the ones that like to complain. I think something should be done about the noise, but if it is done it should be done by the bike companies and not the local governments or law enforcement. Look I forget who but a couple people on this thread were talking about getting the govt. involve and making new regulations, and making soundtests mandatory. Please stop promoting this BULL. Look if the state, and local governments, get involve in making new regulations on noise, we are just going to have to pay more dumb fees, that will more than likely be super high. Or we will have to modify our bikes to make them quieter which also cost money. Look Our sport is already EXPENSIVE enough as it is. I know some of you out there with toy haulers and HUGE RV's dont care, but speaking as a struggling college student that already invests a lot of money in this sport and just came back from ocotillo Wells and slept in the bed of his truck with two of his buddies, I cannot afford to modify or pay more stupid fee's, and fines. I think that these new regulations and requirements will further kill our sport because it would just make it more expensive, and some of the younger people like me wont be able to afford it. I already invest about 30%-50% of my monthly income in this sport, because i love it that much so NO MORE FEE's PLEASE.

P.s I ride a YZ250 so i am not a four stroke promoter, but i know that if the govt. gets involved, they would find a way to make me with a 2 stroke pay for the 4 stroke mistakes. SO once again something should be done, but done by the bike companies. If they produce quieter better performing bikes, eventually this need for loudness will fade away.

Posted by: JWW---------------------

Im not all that excited about the govt or local officials pushing policy but if they dont things will never change. I cant stand the loud bikes and really wish it was enforced more.

If someone can buy a bike for over 5k they shouldnt complain about another $150-400 for a quiet exhaust.

Look I probably sound like a jerk but I spent many years waiting to get back into the sport due to not having enough $$$$. If quiet bikes are required and you cant afford then find another hobby.

Posted by: sonnysair6---------------------

THere you go, you just set the perfect example on how regulations and fines can kill this sport, you told me to find a new hobby, when i Absolutely love this sport, I go almost every week if i don't go to Glen Helen I go to the Ocotillo, I love this sport, so i am not just a monthly or every now and then rider with toy haulers and money, i already invest plenty of money riding every week and i am just saying more fee's will hurt the younger generation like me, oh and i did not buy a 5k bike, i bought a $2300 2005 YZ250.

WHy most of these people are worried about on this thread is that they are no longer going to be able to ride in their properties or the places closest to them. For example we us to ride a mile away from my buddies house in Riverside, but they are no longer allowed to ride there because as the years pass the houses started getting closer and closer, and people started to complain. Look if you really love this sport, you would not mind driving an hour to Glen Helen or 2 and a half to Ocotillo. STOP BEING LAZY..

Posted by: sonnysair6---------------------

"I cant stand the loud bikes and really wish it was enforced more."
-----Posted By JWW

P.S If you cannot stand the loud bikes, maybe you should find a new sport. This sport is naturally Loud.. Or Camp far away were the noise wont bug ya.

Posted by: JWW---------------------

I know I sound like a jerk but Im not. The sound thing is just getting old quick.

On a track away from housing its ok but in the mountains around other people it sucks.

Posted by: JWW---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by sonnysair6

P.S If you cannot stand the loud bikes, maybe you should find a new sport. This sport is naturally Loud.. Or Camp far away were the noise wont bug ya.

I dont really want to get in another silly internet arguement but I just want to ask a question. No judgement or arguement.

Does it really not bother you when a bike rides by and its so loud it hurts your ears and you squint your eyes?

Again no judgement being made....just curious.

Posted by: sonnysair6---------------------

Sorry about that, i did not meant that to sound as an argument.

To answer your question, and this is being completely honest it really does not bother me when a bike passes by me, and its super loud, I am not one of those people that think loudness is cool (like i said i have a YZ250), it's just that getting into this sport i knew its a loud and fast sport, and if some riders get their jollies by having super loud pipes, then so be it, they are having fun and who am I to stop them from having fun, cause in the end that's what this sport, hobby, or whatever you want to call it, is all about. Its about having fun.

Posted by: JWW---------------------

We have different opinions but I do respect yours.

Posted by: 2-Strokes 4-ever---------------------

Are the governments decisions really logical? Who will it take to preserve our sport?

Posted by: LEllis7motox---------------------

Posted by: Ol'89r---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by sonnysair6

To answer your question, and this is being completely honest it really does not bother me when a bike passes by me, and its super loud, I am not one of those people that think loudness is cool (like i said i have a YZ250), it's just that getting into this sport i knew its a loud and fast sport, and if some riders get their jollies by having super loud pipes, then so be it, they are having fun and who am I to stop them from having fun, cause in the end that's what this sport, hobby, or whatever you want to call it, is all about. Its about having fun.

It's not you we have to worry about. Most of us don't mind a little noise but the general public hates it. Those are the people we have to worry about.

You say you used to ride by your buddys house in Riverside County. Why do you think you can't ride there anymore? Most likely because of the noise. Did you bother to go to any of the meetings in Riverside when they were trying to shut us down? Or were you too LAZY. If you did go to any of those meetings then you would know how big of an issue noise is. Have you ever gone to a BLM meeting? I know Jeff (JWW) has. Have you ever written a letter or sent an email to your political representives? Have you ever asked you local dealer why they are not involved with the land closure issues? Did you know they are trying to shut down about half of Occotillo Wells? Did you know most of the places we used to ride in the California desert are now closed to off roaders and they are working on closing the rest?

If you have never done any of these things then, maybe you should find a new sport because guys like you are destroying it for the rest of us. It's all about fun. Have your fun until you get kicked out and then go somewhere else until you get kicked out and soon there will be no place left to go.

Noise it a big thing but, our lack of involvement and outright arrogance is the biggest issue. We have the ability to flood the council chambers with people on our side but nobody shows up. People will drive all the way out to Occotillo to ride but won't take the time to go to a meeting ten miles away to insure the land stays open. Who is being lazy here? We will spend hours on the net arguing with each other about who is to blame but won't spend a few minutes to write a letter or send an email to our lawmakers.

If we don't police our own the government will.

Posted by: sonnysair6---------------------

Your calling me LAZY

First off I am not From Riverside, I us to go ride there with a buddy. I live in Long beach, Far away from any dirt place, So when I go ride it takes at least an hour drive to get there. But i guess you were to lazy to read my other comment also. WHat i said for lazy people who don't bother to read the whole thread.

WHat it comes down to is LAZYNESS by people that us to ride 10 minutes away from their house and now have to go 30 minutes away to ride. If your really committed to this sport you'll drive the 30 minutes or 2 hours it takes to get to a riding spot. People are bitching that they couln't ride 5 minutes away from their house anymore, dude STOP BEING LAZY and if you really want to ride go to Ocotillo, Mojave, or the GLEN HELEN which is really like 30 minutes from RIverside. FOR ME its at least a 1 hour 15 min drive to get to my nearest riding spot which is Glen Helen, but i usually go to Ocotillo which is 2 1/2 hours, so im guessing i am not LAZY, I really love this sport, and if you can't drive an hour or two to get to a riding spot, then Maybe you should not be in this sport.

THIS IS WHAT I MEANT Ol'89r. NEXT time don't be lazy and read the whole thread before you post a response.

P.s Thanks for miss quoting me, If you would have read the whole thread, you would have seen that JWW specifically asked me if the noise bothered me, and i gave him my honest answer, and i know its not dirt bike riders that the noise bugs, but the people that don't ride, but i guess i had to say this again cause you were to lazy to read the first sentences in my first post.

Posted by: sonnysair6---------------------

Yes i can drive two hours to ocotillo, and no i don't know how to get involve in dirt bike activism, cause i live far away from any riding spot. The way i preserve these OHV areas is through my fees, Have you ever been to Ocotillo or Mojave, there is nothing there, these towns sole means or surviving is the people that go riding up there. So I am guessing if you move to Borrego Springs you know what your going to be dealing with. If they ever take away a place like Ocotillo for riding, then we have to ask another question "Our we killing our Earth", because if cities like SD and LA get sooo crowded that people have to move to Mojave or Ocotillo then, we would have greater problems to deal with. Look it is awesome your writing letters and stuff, i don't have time for that i am finishing college, and starting my own business. So yes only time i have is those weekends when i go riding (city hall is closed on the weakends). So for right now I will keep preserving our OHV parks by paying my Fees. ANd bringing more of my friends into this sport, who are also paying there fees, and promoting this sport.

Posted by: 2-Strokes 4-ever---------------------

Our club (Midwest Trail Riders Assoc.) has club property that is two hours away from where most of us live, in the St Louis area. We put on the "Show-Me 200 National Dual Sport Ride" every year...... people come from all around the country to ride it. Our 200 mile trail route is an enormous task to maintain/get ready for this ride. I'm feeling guilty because I've only made it down to the property four times in the last couple months to help with trail maintainance, restroom construction, campground clearing/cleanup etc. Been riding ONCE in the last three months. There are (as in MANY things) a select, hard working few that do the mojority of the work........ behind the scenes, while many of these people go totally unrecognized. If you WANT to get involved you will, or vice-versa. It's an expensive sport. You play, you pay.

Posted by: Ol'89r---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by sonnysair6

THere you go, you just set the perfect example on how regulations and fines can kill this sport, you told me to find a new hobby,

WHy most of these people are worried about on this thread is that they are no longer going to be able to ride in their properties or the places closest to them. For example we us to ride a mile away from my buddies house in Riverside, but they are no longer allowed to ride there because as the years pass the houses started getting closer and closer, and people started to complain. Look if you really love this sport, you would not mind driving an hour to Glen Helen or 2 and a half to Ocotillo. STOP BEING LAZY..

Posted by: fatcat216---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by sonnysair6

So yes only time i have is those weekends when i go riding (city hall is closed on the weakends). So for right now I will keep preserving our OHV parks by paying my Fees. ANd bringing more of my friends into this sport, who are also paying there fees, and promoting this sport.

That's cool sonnysair6. I think ol'89r's point is, before you go to the trouble to post an opinion "loud pipes are part of the sport and quit your crying if you don't like it" that you think of the consequences of that sort of attitude.

Secondly, a letter to your city council or federal agency could be accomplished in the same amount of time as arguing and being pissy on the internet. I won't go into the credentials of the guy you are venting at. You might do a search on his name however. It would be worth your effort before you say anything more.

Tony Eeds,Truespode,Muddslinger and others have posted some really good information on how to get involved on one of these forums. Check the Land/Legal Protect Your Rights forum. This thread, however, was just about educating oneself on how we are hurting ourselves with the "it's just fun, so what" testosterone attitude.

There are a lot of really great people working hard to help you have a place to ride. Being ugly to them is shooting yourself in the foot. They are doing the work you don't seem to have time for with your busy schedule. A cheerful thank you goes a long way in encouraging these people to stay at a hard task.

And if you won't say it, I will...Thanks gang.

Posted by: fatcat216---------------------

Blue Ribbon Coalition

http://www.dirtrider.net/forums3/showthread.php?t=90164

One action alert of interest:

http://capwiz.com/amacycle/issues/a...OCESS=Read+More

Posted by: krushnburn---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okiewan

No doubt they can be / are loud ... our very own 2-T test bike in the new Dirt Rider Mag barely made sound, there were 4-T's that blew less sound. Yeah, our 2-T is a ported 500, but still....

I will disagree that the sound of the 2-T's "travel twice as far", it's commonly known that the 4-T's freqs are guilty of that very thing.

Actually 2-T frequencies travel twice as far since mid and high end frequencies are 2x+ faster than bass frequencies. This is due to bass frequencies being so slow that dissipate much quicker.

Anyhow, thanks for the education on "LOUD IS NOT COOL". Im a new-born rider. If it wasn't for this thread, my rookie a*s would still think that loud bikes are rad.

Posted by: Ol'89r---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by sonnysair6

THere you go, you just set the perfect example on how regulations and fines can kill this sport, you told me to find a new hobby, when i Absolutely love this sport, I go almost every week if i don't go to Glen Helen I go to the Ocotillo, I love this sport, so i am not just a monthly or every now and then rider with toy haulers and money, i already invest plenty of money riding every week and i am just saying more fee's will hurt the younger generation like me,

WHy most of these people are worried about on this thread is that they are no longer going to be able to ride in their properties or the places closest to them. For example we us to ride a mile away from my buddies house in Riverside, but they are no longer allowed to ride there because as the years pass the houses started getting closer and closer, and people started to complain. Look if you really love this sport, you would not mind driving an hour to Glen Helen or 2 and a half to Ocotillo. STOP BEING LAZY..

I did read your whole post including the part where you told us to STOP BEING LAZY. I didn't see anywhere where I misquoted you. I like a little noise too but when it is one of the main reasons with losing riding areas we need to step back and re-evaluate what is important.

I have no problem with driving to a riding area. I have driven thousands of miles to ride/race a motorcycle. I have been to Glen Helen, Star West, Perris and all of the so cal tracks so many times I can't count them. When I was younger and lived in Downey, we used to ride our motorcycles down the San Gabriel river bed to Seal Beach and then up PCH to a little practice track next to PCH where Marina Pacifica is now. Never had to worry about getting busted. When I lived in Lakewood right next to your home town of Long Beach, I used to drive to Gorman, Kennedy Meadows and a place called Holiday up the other side of Mojave to ride and traveled all across the country to race. So, I have no problem with driving to where I want to ride. I also have no problem with driving hundreds of miles to a BLM meeting when our riding areas are at stake.

You sound like most of the people I talk to about attending meetings. "I have to go to school/work." "The meetings are during the week and not on weekends." "I still have my little riding spot to go to and I don't care about those other places." "I'm just a kid and I don't know how to get involved." Well, I'll tell you how to get involved. You can thank me later.

First of all, sending your money to the green sticker fund is a waste of time and money. ( I know, It's the law.) These fees are being used against us. The green sticker fund was originated with the main purpose of creating and maintaining OHV parks. When the program first started many new parks were created. Now these fees are going towards enforcement. There have not been any new parks created in 20 years. Many of the existing parks are being decreased in size. The fees have been more than doubled this year and now on top of the green sticker fee we also have to pay for the Forest Adventure Pass just to park our tow vehicles in the forest. The Elsinore Sheriff Dept spent $160,000 of our green sticker money on a truck, trailer and several hi buck quads to patrol the hills and kick us out. The San Berdo police just spent over $200,000 of our green sticker money on the same thing. The envirowacko's have figured out how to get their hands on our green sticker money and use it for species protection and buffer zones for parks that don't even exist. So, keep sending that money in so they can use it against us.

If that is not reason enough to get involved then I don't know what to tell you.

A better place to spend your money would be to join one or more of the many organizations that are actively fighting for our side. There are many off road organizations that will do the work for you if you are too busy to attend a meeting. Just send them money. They will also keep you informed as to where and when the meetings are in case you ever feel a need to attend one. You can go to your local dealer and buy a Cycle News newspaper. They stay on top of current laws and most of the off road organizations advertise in there. There are many links to our political rep's that we can send a letter or email. In the time it took you to respond to my post, you could have done that.

There are hundreds of posts about land closures and what to do about them on the internet. All you have to do is a little searching. Saying you don't know how to get involved is a cop-out.

It's a personal choice. You either get involved or you don't. No excuses. If you think they can't shut down Occotillo or even the Mojave desert, I got news for ya'. Like I said, there is a geothermal power company planning on shutting down about half of Occotillo. The Mojave is under attack and many of the places we used to ride are now closed. Last weekend I went to the Colorado river to visit a friend of mine.(Drove over 200 miles.)

Just two years ago we used to ride all of the sandwashes and trails around there without being hassled. Now, the BLM has posted those washes and trails with wilderness signs and they patrol and give big tickets for riding there. A friend of mine was coming down a ridge and saw several BLM rangers at the bottom of the trail so he took an alternate trail. When he got to the bottom of the alternate trail there were BLM rangers waiting for him. He was arrested for evading arrest. He was never warned or told that he was under arrest and never had any contact with the rangers until they stopped him and never even tried to run. But now he may have to do some jail time.

This is some serious stuff going on here folks. I guarantee you guys, if we don't ALL get involved with the political side of off roading, there won't be anyplace to ride legally in 10 years. There may be tracks but many of those are under attack also. Mostly because of the NOISE we all love.

BTW, I can still ride on my property and in the local hills because I dualsported my trail bikes and can now legally go most anywhere I want to ride. I don't waste my money on green stickers anymore.

sonnysair6.
If I haven't pissed you off too much I would like to invite you out to my place and show you some really good trails. I'm a bit older than you but I'll try to keep up. And, it's only 45 minutes from Long Beach. (On a good day.)

Ol'89r

Posted by: Ol'89r---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatcat216

Blue Ribbon Coalition

http://www.dirtrider.net/forums3/showthread.php?t=90164

One action alert of interest:

http://capwiz.com/amacycle/issues/a...OCESS=Read+More

Thank you fatcat.

Posted by: High Lord Gomer---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by sonnysair6

city hall is closed on the weakends

LOL! Does this imply they are open on the strongends?

BTW, I can print out your posts and send them to you if you want to use them as justifcation for a refund from your college. I think they owe you buckets!

Posted by: DocWito---------------------

im new to bikes and im sure you lot have good reasons and know so much more but i must add something which has been running round my head especially the past 7-8 years.............all around me there are more and more regulations and rulez for everything........noise, housing, licencing, work, privatisation, etc........it seems that everybody has a problem with everything and wants to get some rulz made to stop it or change it......this is the main problem if you ask me.........one day were gonna need a licence to buy food from the store!!!

since i was small if i hered a loud bike coming down the street my heart would jump and i would stare in awe.......seems bikes have always been pretty loud......just part of it

Posted by: jjm525---------------------

This post ran up 6 pages on Thumpertalk in the last 48 hours or so,,,

Long story short,,,well its still gonna be long

I'm a long time member at a AMA MX track with over 40 years of history promoting MX. Like every other track in the world we have new neighbors building homes and tightening our property buffers more and more everyday.

The 4 stroke boon is a noise revolution within our already loud sport, our starting gate drops and can be heard by one of our members on his front porch at 5 miles away from our track. A single 4t MXer can be heard pretty clearly at 2 miles away, and very clearly at our neighbors homes, many within a mile of us.

We tried a dozen Db Dawgs in every bike we could. At under $50 they are effective at WOT, cutting the sound dramatically and were cheap and easy enough to install and remove. A local pro ran a RMZ450 with a open full Yosh for a 30 minute moto, we added a Db Dawg to his bike and he ran 3 more laps all at the same 1:21 lap time of his practice. WOW, didn't hurt the fastest guys lap times but went from a tremendous racket to a 3.5 hp mower output in sound!!!

But remember, every 15 year old Novice needs to send thunder thru the valley!!! We made Db Dawgs mandatory at our track for members and their guests on non-race days. With a single clip adjustment to my JD jetted 450 I couldn't feel any difference in power though I noticed I needed to adjust from riding with my ears as I was over jumping everything on the track.

The problem, a few MXers feel that they have the right to make as much noise as they want,

first, because "we were here first"

second, because the bike can't be fast without noise

third, because we like it loud and finally

fourth, the bike will blow up because of back pressure. "It will burn the valves and just blow up".

My own 450 has 91 hours on it total, 51 with a Db Dawg and no valve adjustment needed but they are sure their bikes will not last a week because someone said they will blow up, though they can't explain the reasons why this might happen???

These points are apparantly indisputable and I can't seem to find the kryptonite to dissolve any of them. I'm not going to bother defending the quiet bike issue, if you don't get it you apparantly can't be convinced by sound reasoning and logic, test results or lap times. Your the one who will still go buy a freeer flowing & even louder pipe even though Jeremy McGrath has stated he can't use all the power of a stock 450.

Here is my question, why dosen't the AMA really drop the friggin sound limits at WOT, the test in place now is at 50% RPM limits, nobody is complaining about a bike at half throttle. My bike hit 94 db with the stock pipe, all good & well under the AMA limits, but would hit over 120 db at WOT, as in really riding it!!!

I'd love to see a MX or off road mag really put a test to the "loud is power" BS and run bikes back to back or against open piped bikes to finally prove we can race and ride really quiet bikes without having any more tracks closed because of noise. Our own riders are putting the rope around the neck of MX, they are making it easy for "them" to shut us down!!!

FMF makes the great Q4, one of our riders is a solid A class athlete, with a hearing disability. He rode his 250f with the Q4 and felt no difference in power, said it was less vibration in the bike. He qualified for LL with the Q4. One of the fastest riders I know and you can't hear his bike at 100 yards away under full power!!!

Loud pipes fool riders into thinking "speed". Noise is converted into power in the human mind, even if the bike is actually slower. The open piped bike without correct jetting is a classic case, the guy with the popping lean 450 jerking around the track, you know him and so do I!!!

AMA, Dirt Rider, Dirt Bike, MX Action!!! Somebody step up before we are all forced into arenas, we are loosing the outdoors, fast. In a sport that already is in the cross hairs of the Sierra Club and Green movement can we really afford to piss off EVERYBODY??? Count the people on your street who will not care a whit if your favorite track/trail/ORVP is closed for good? How many will be happy to see your bikes rolled into a dumpster so they never have to see/hear it again? How many of us would want to be bombarded by the same sound levels in our homes on any day of the year???

Sorry if that is too much of a vent, (I know its a loooong read) but I ride as much as I can, I'd rather nobody knew it, nobody was pissed about it and nobody ever tried to stop me from doing it!!! ,,,

***New user here, hell of a first post right, not the usual hi, how ya doing drivel but bla, bla bla,,,

I see a editorials & comments about keeping bikes quiet and then a few pages later a MX bike with a full open performance exhaust with the old "closed course" exemption BS. If that noise was somehow blocked at the edge of that closed course, fine, but it isn't and that is a big part of our problem.

How about a real test of 250f & 450fs with a stock, performance and QUIET exhaust, like the FMF Q4, with a variety of skilled riders and LAP TIMES!!! I've timed it, seen it, and had to tell the pro rider he was just as fast when he was making NO noise!!! The TT thread is a good read if nothing else, we need to do more, everyone. Thanks.

Posted by: digifox---------------------

I know that feeling

i`m not the only one that ride around here(on the trail by my house)
there are quads,2T and 4T`s

the 2-strokes you can`t even hear until to walk IN the woods(where the sound reverbs off the trees and such)
the 4-strokes you can hear them at my house...and farther away
the quads aren't really all that loud..

like my bike..Yes my "silencer" tip has been taken off and its a little noisy just sitting close to it. but when i`m riding through the wood everyone says they cant even hear me.

Posted by: flyingfuzzball---------------------

the reason people hear the 4t through the trees is because its more of a bass sound and bass travels farther and isnt dampened as easily.

its kinda like when you are sitting next to some annoying person at a redlight and they listen to rap with the bass turned up really loud and you can hear it perfectly through their car and yours.

Posted by: motocross3---------------------

Even if you get a magazine to do the loud is power test you'll still have the guys that go buy a loud exhaust, then go riding. The first thing they'll say is listen to how it sounds, but its a great idea cause it will change some of the serious riders who want to save this sport. Another idea is to get all the pro guys to use quiet exhaust systems and promote them

Posted by: motocross3---------------------

I hate when you can hear someone elses music, and my friend has a crf 230 completly stock and its way louder than my KX 125, i can ride mine down the streets and they can barely hear me but he starts his up and they can hear it for miles, I'm going to talke to him about the Q silencer

Posted by: kim80y---------------------

If you want a quiet 2 stroke, and its even been tried on a few 4 strokes, get a Db Snorkel, it got my YZ490 down to below 92 Db at 5500rpm, way more RPM than tit needed to be for the sae test!!!
Excellent article!!!

Posted by: Motomingo---------------------

I didn't read all the pages so if im bringing up something someone else did i apologize

Its not all people putting on loud pipes i uncorked/jetted my CRF230 it made it louder not to a huge sound change but i'd say 25-35% louder its still probably louder than it needs to be.
The one thing i can appreciate about my YZ250 is that altho those 2-strokes are high and raspy the "high" pitched noise doesn't carry as far as those damn 4-strokes. All those loud pipes have to do with those young punks who put crap on there stupid little civics, or at that any other little sissy imports. I do know that my old mans 66 Chevelle is way louder than any dirt bike i have ever heard. It has 3" flowmasters running through with a big block 462 under the hood. All in all I have to say that they're going to have to catch me and take my bike away for me to stop riding.

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motomingo

. . . they're going to have to catch me and take my bike away for me to stop riding.

They will. You'll run out of gas and have to go back to the rig sometime.

Posted by: Rubey---------------------

The following text is from a RacerX interview with Marc de Reuver after he took third in the first 450 moto at Southwick.

"You also have the Honda factory bike this time, too. Did you bring your suspension settings from Europe, or are you riding a purely American bike?
At home, I also have the same bike. The exact same bike, same suspension, same engine... it’s so loud! If you came with that bike in Europe at a practice track, they’d shoot you with a gun, man – the track owner. He’d lose everything when you come with a bike like that. So we put, like, a Europe muffler on – a longer one – but it’s still loud. And we put on a heavier flywheel to tone it down a bit. It’s still a little bit too fast for me, but I can handle it now."

Point being... is that louder does not equate to being faster.

Posted by: fmfsv5---------------------

i puy in my ear pohnes for my ipod so that nothing is able to distract me when i am riding my bike around the trails and i just run stock but if the exhaust is louder it will give you more horse power because on little fiftys when you take off the silencer for the pipe it is loud as no other and it gives it more horse power. when i rode that bike with the silencer off it made me wheelie so louder is more powerful

Posted by: Ol'89r---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by fmfsv5

i puy in my ear pohnes for my ipod so that nothing is able to distract me when i am riding my bike around the trails and i just run stock but if the exhaust is louder it will give you more horse power because on little fiftys when you take off the silencer for the pipe it is loud as no other and it gives it more horse power. when i rode that bike with the silencer off it made me wheelie so louder is more powerful

It sounds like you wear your ear phones for your ipod during your English/grammar/spelling classes too. You shouldn't do that. It makes you sound like a complete idiot.

Just my humble opinion.

Posted by: Hevster1---------------------

On one half of the equation you have those who feel their genitalia increased in size by running the loudest pipe possible. On the other hand you have those who know that loud bikes = less ground.
Bottom line is that Mike Lafferty's bike is quiet. Most pro's don't need loud bikes. Why do you? Are you faster than them?

Posted by: Wolf---------------------

This is probably the one instance where I go against everything I believe in and want more "government"....the AMA needs to step up. The current sound tests are a joke, no matter what number db they mandate, I haven't seen anything enforced at a track. Obviously we as a dirtbike community have proven that we are too ignorant to govern ourselves, the manufacturers haven't really changed anything, the aftermarket companies are still not getting it, and the local clubs aren't going to turn you away with your loud pipe, they need your money...so...AMA...get your heads out of your collective arses, implement a drastically lower sound limit, and enforce it. Test sound at actual riding levels, not at 1/4 or 1/2 throttle.
Our sport needs a shake up...like a 92 db limit at WOT...

Posted by: zachattack1---------------------

hmm, it isn't a dirt bike without noise but I agree. For me, we own 100 acres and just a few neighbors so i really don't need to worry.

Posted by: diesel23---------------------

I like the idea that you sould have a quieter bike to race. If you get aworks or gnccs to make it a rule than people would not like it but would understand. But no one is going to do it one there own they would be at a disatvantig.

Posted by: _JOE_---------------------

I like the 92db at WOT idea.

Posted by: Kawi4life---------------------

I'm not even going to be able to run my stock exhaust on my 07KX450f let alone think about something louder - do they even make louder? I got my first ever complaint about noise on my first ride on the bike today and I was up on the mountain/train tracks where I've trail ridden for 23 years straight! I didn't really notice it myself with the helmet on (gawd the bike is totally awesome other than the loudness - blows away my previous KX250 2-stroke in every way imaginable - love the bike!) but damn.... complaints and bothering people isn't cool, gotta keep the peace and definitely don't want any problems with the police!

I ordered a FMF Q.... Hope I got the best all around silencer for performance/volume. Not really sure what to get since I'm really on the clueless side with the new 4-bangers.

Posted by: D'Artagnanloyd_rm---------------------

great article. never really put to much thought into something like this till now. Even though i still have my stock pipe on my rm125, i was pretty interested in this.
thanks for posting this.

Posted by: deanR---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by _JOE_

I like the 92db at WOT idea.

All this sound stuff should not just be for dirt bikes. I hear a lot of loud quads too. The race quads are just as loud as dirt bikes.

And Joe, I got that KX250

Posted by: mihm82---------------------

one thing that i have noticed around my way, is the the places we used to be allowed, we are now banned from, not because of dust, but because of noise. i agree, louder is not better

Posted by: maxkiks77---------------------

Its important to communicate about this, but not while carryng "loaded 45 guns around" as one of the posters, angryneighbor, replied. What a tool he is. Thats crazy he says all the motocross riders are meth heads. Sounds to me like he has the issues.

Posted by: bikeeatsdirt---------------------

I think ear plugs might be a good idea but I'd feel kinda weird wearing them. Maybe helmets could come with better ear protection?

Posted by: struthiin---------------------

Good article

Posted by: Neodrivesageo---------------------

Its not an issue of noise. The government just likes to find more ways to tax and control the citizens. I live within a half mile of both an airport, and a train track. All I hear is noise all day. should I be able to complain? No. Because it's my own fault for moving here. What would happen if I did call someone and complain? They would tell me to move. The average dirt biker doesn't have deep pockets at all, compared to the big companys that would love to get ahold of that land and develop it.

With that said, I agree that there is no reason for all that noise.

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