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St. Louis Spoiler
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Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Poor Chad. You've got to feel bad for the guy ... he can't stay in front of JS even with 12 bikes between them.

Had Stewart put that take-out on Reed, the net would be bogged down, lol. Three things in James' favor come to mind... 1) no take out in response, 2) kept his cool on the podium and 3) slowed-up once he got by Reed, I'm sure Kawasaki is VERY happy about that. His pace coming thru the pack and getting around Reed was insane. If I heard correctly, he was in 17th when he got going again.

Chad says he doesn't want to get "pushed around out there"... the pass JS put on him was clean (prior to the take out). I guess what he really meant to say is "I'm tired of being humbled every week".

Posted by: moronguy---------------------

the pass didn't look that dirty to me, just good hard racing. I've seen Stewart throw more passes like that then I have Reed.

Posted by: kmccune---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okiewan

the pass JS put on him was clean (prior to the take out).

Sorry Okie, I have no idea what this means.

But I do agree, it must suck being Chad right now.

Posted by: oldguy---------------------

I was wonderring who all those people are that are picking on the WARRIOR (reed). He did say he didn't mean for BOTH of them to go down when he took out Stewart. To me he slipped and said what he really meant to do "take out Stewart"
Reed needs to quit whining and then playing the warrior and riding injured (massive super human injuries) and just get out there and race.
The little respect for him as a human is wearing thin- I still respect that he has everything needed to be a front runner if he could get his head on straight.
Kudos to JBS for keeping it quiet and respectable on the podium, he showed what he was made up of on the track (now don't take this as I am converted to being a JBS fan either)

Posted by: just_a_rider---------------------

The only way any one is going to beat Stewart is if he crashes but after this race this might not even apply.

Posted by: rickyd---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okiewan

His pace coming thru the pack and getting around Reed was insane. If I heard correctly, he was in 17th when he got going again.
.

At some point while he was coming through the pack, his lap times were faster than RC's, they mentioned it on the webcast. He got back up in 17th

Posted by: mxneagle---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okiewan

2) kept his cool on the podium.

Did you listen to JBS on the webcast? Didn't keep his cool then. He said Chad started talking s*^t to him and then pushed him (or something there abouts). Watching the tv coverage, JBS appeared to be the one who started talking the $%&* as Chad was rolling up. Not that I really care what either of those 2 do anyways (although it does appear the JBS is getting better at behaving like an adult)

Posted by: Mxrider26x---------------------

OH MY GOSH is that really Okiewan ripping on Chad Reed for something that he would stick up for JBS for doing? What a surprise!

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Whaaa?

If James takes out Chad, I'll make the same call. If JS would have retaliated in kind, I would be rippin on him as well.
Rubin' is racin' until you start knocking people over intentionally.

Posted by: Chili---------------------

After watching that I'm shocked Stewart didn't knock Chad into next week when he went by him the second time. Don't get me wrong I'm glad to see Reed is po'd and maybe has some fire but he's got nothing to be upset with in regards to that pass.

Posted by: Mxrider26x---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chili

After watching that I'm shocked Stewart didn't knock Chad into next week when he went by him the second time. Don't get me wrong I'm glad to see Reed is po'd and maybe has some fire but he's got nothing to be upset with in regards to that pass.

It didn't look like Reed was going to talk to JBS until he started motioning him over. If you listened to JBS's little interview on the webcast, he was really trying to make himself sound like an angel.

Posted by: just_a_rider---------------------

It was a clean block pass, if any body is at fualt it's Stewart for pushing it knowing Reed had the line. So it was outa place for JS to even say any thing twords Reed.

Posted by: kawicam250---------------------

i thought i heard that JBS was in dead last when he started his comeback, but they did mention him in 17th in the race. Stewart was flying by everyone like they were part of the track

, congrats to him. Reed made himself look silly on the podium. James seemed nice on the podium, but i think that the pass was Reed's fault. Stewart had his line, and Reed cut him off. in my eyes, the championship is over, like most predicted, unless something very serious happens. Reed is gonna have to start proving his worth, cant wait for Daytona

. no talk about the Tedesco/Ferry wreck

. Ivan's bike flipped and nailed Ferry in the face

, seems like they both got injured cause they both finished in the bottom 5.

Posted by: just_a_rider---------------------

Yes it did look ruff, Ferry went over and started to get on Tadesco's bike and then realized it wasn't his and let it fall back to the ground, I'd say he was a little out of it.
How can you say it was Reeds fault? He had the inside and was ahead a half, a very good block pass that went south because of Stewart, why would JS even push it like that as fast as he is? He would have gotten him any way and more than likely won the race so he costed his self a win for being over aggressive.

Posted by: rickyd---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by just_a_rider

Yes it did look ruff, Ferry went over and started to get on Tadesco's bike and then realized it wasn't his and let it fall back to the ground, I'd say he was a little out of it.

That was funny! Could Doc Bodnar of had him Black flagged due to him possibly being semi unconscious?

Posted by: Mx523---------------------

JS had a clean block pass, Reed just wasn't happy that he finished third.

Posted by: Chili---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by just_a_rider

It was a clean block pass, if any body is at fualt it's Stewart for pushing it knowing Reed had the line. So it was outa place for JS to even say any thing twords Reed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by just_a_rider

How can you say it was Reeds fault? He had the inside and was ahead a half, a very good block pass that went south because of Stewart, why would JS even push it like that as fast as he is? He would have gotten him any way and more than likely won the race so he costed his self a win for being over aggressive.

Here watch it again repeatedly and tell me how Stewart is going to avoid or protect from that? Reed comes straight out of the side at Stewarts front wheel, there was one intent there and it was not to block pass James.

Video courtesy of BobbyM on another board. www.troyengstrom.com/reed_open_door.wmv

Posted by: just_a_rider---------------------

As they say, HEY! thats racin. I give, people will always see it different even though I'm a KX guy and Stewart and Vilopoto are my favs, I guess I just feel sorry for the rest out there, GO Team GREEN.

Posted by: robrm250---------------------

what I see watching the video it looks like Reed tried to take out front wheel of Bubba and I don't like either,Windham and RC fan.

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

JS chased him down and passed CR clean,CR gave all he could,his only chance at beating him,take him out! Even if he could have just block pass,what is he gonna do,JS is faster! Thanks Chili

Posted by: FruDaddy---------------------

OK, I watched it again, and saw the same thing as before. Reed was protecting his position from the inside and clearly coming out in front. The tactic is exactly the same as what Stewart would have done. The difference, Stewart would have expected Reed to back off, perhaps HE should have instead of pushing the issue. Maybe now Stewart will show a little respect for CR, something I have NEVER seen him do. Reed may only be the third fastest rider on the track, but he isn't anywhere near as sloppy as JBS.
After the race, it was clear that Stewart was motioning for Reed to stop (and ignoring RC in the process).

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

What color glasses are you wearing FruDaddy, lol.

Posted by: TheGrinch---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by FruDaddy

OK, I watched it again, and saw the same thing as before. Reed was protecting his position from the inside and clearly coming out in front. The tactic is exactly the same as what Stewart would have done. The difference, Stewart would have expected Reed to back off, perhaps HE should have instead of pushing the issue. Maybe now Stewart will show a little respect for CR, something I have NEVER seen him do. Reed may only be the third fastest rider on the track, but he isn't anywhere near as sloppy as JBS.
After the race, it was clear that Stewart was motioning for Reed to stop (and ignoring RC in the process).

I watched the pass several time and agree with FruDaddy. Reed managed to duck to the inside & started to clearly take the lead. As he did he started to protect his line & moved across Stewart's line. James should have backed off.

That's racing folks.

Posted by: Thump---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chili

Hard to argue with visual facts...

Posted by: Thump---------------------

As far as James motioning CR over to him, I agree he did. He gave him the big thumbs up and you could see the smile in his face. He told Chad that he had no hard feelings and good job. It looked like Chad got pissed and started yelling at him and you can clearly see when he did James started to leave the situation, as he did Chad decided to shove him.

The more I watch Chad Reed the more I like to see him get ruined by Stewart. Going back to the 125's when Chad made some off color remarks about James which resulted in Stewart nearly stopping on the track to let Reed by, then with 2 laps left went by him and put like 10 seconds on him? And now this.... Chad takes him out, James is stalled 30+ seconds back of Reed when he got going and manages to catch, pass cleanly, gap and settle into a pace. Makes me giggle.

Remember folks, it was this race last year that Chad won and gave his "a lesser man would have given up, but I knew I had the speed to run with these guys." Even though RC DNF'd on the first lap with a broken shock linkage and James crashed out.

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

CR would clearly need ROCKET packs to pull that move off! JS can do it cause he is FASTER! If you are slower and you pull a move like that you are a SPODE!

Posted by: mxneagle---------------------

yeah, looks like Reedy did a pretty good job of accelerating out after squaring under JBS who was looking to try to cut back across the inside to block Reeds line. Hindsight for JBS is that he should have just ripped around the outside instead of slowing down and trying to block the inside line. Looks like the two got hooked together and Reeds momentum dragged JBS down. I say thats just racing. It really doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things since JBS proved he could give Reed a full pack head start and still win.

Posted by: Mxrider26x---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thump

As far as James motioning CR over to him, I agree he did. He gave him the big thumbs up and you could see the smile in his face. He told Chad that he had no hard feelings and good job. It looked like Chad got pissed and started yelling at him and you can clearly see when he did James started to leave the situation, as he did Chad decided to shove him.

The more I watch Chad Reed the more I like to see him get ruined by Stewart. Going back to the 125's when Chad made some off color remarks about James which resulted in Stewart nearly stopping on the track to let Reed by, then with 2 laps left went by him and put like 10 seconds on him? And now this.... Chad takes him out, James is stalled 30+ seconds back of Reed when he got going and manages to catch, pass cleanly, gap and settle into a pace. Makes me giggle.

Remember folks, it was this race last year that Chad won and gave his "a lesser man would have given up, but I knew I had the speed to run with these guys." Even though RC DNF'd on the first lap with a broken shock linkage and James crashed out.

What you are saying is that you hate Chad Reed.

Posted by: Moose---------------------

my opinion on the whole thing...look at reeds bike. when have you ever seen him take a corner that wide, and look what direction his bike is pointing in. it's clear as day. brutal take out on reeds part and not very good sportsmanship.

good for bubba...he deserved 2nd place for sure.

Quote:

but he isn't anywhere near as sloppy as JBS.

Hey, risk equals reward. and so far, that's paid off for bubba.

Posted by: Philip---------------------

If Chad wants RESPECT he better start acting like he deserves it. He needs to come to terms with his place in racing. He is a bridesmaid plan and simple. Chad allowed James to catch him from the back of the pack and punk him. He can blame nobody (although he will try) but himself. He should have put his head down and used all that speed he says he has to keep that from happening. After this week I am sick of his actions.

Posted by: Thump---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mxrider26x

What you are saying is that you hate Chad Reed.

No, I just enjoy seeing him get whipped. Week in and week out he talks about having the speed to run with James and how if he just gets a good start he'll... blah blah blah. He's been doing it for years. I think he has the talent to run with RC and James, but not the desire or heart. Last year he almost got real lucky, both RC and James spotted him a race and he still wound up 3rd. I am sure it is tough for his ego. But he is a "warrior" right?

Posted by: Mxrider26x---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thump

You dont think he has the desire or the heart? That is stupid. All you do is throw out our Chad Reed Separated shoulder joke everytime you get the chance. He is trying, and he just doesn't have the speed. Obviously he wants to win the championship. He is still fast. Also, James had plenty of room to stop like Chad always does when James puts one of those passes on him.

Posted by: rickyd---------------------

I think Reed will win a Championship this year.

Posted by: Moose---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickyd

I think Reed will win a Championship this year.

the warrior championship, because obviously he's a warrior. you know, riding with that hurt shoulder and all.

Posted by: rickyd---------------------

Could you please be a bit more original?

Posted by: Kawidude---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickyd

I think Reed will win a Championship this year.

In the AMA???

Posted by: rickyd---------------------

Yes
Autrailian Motorcycle Assoc.

Stewarts had some nice get off's this season, bound to happen.. Remember Daytona last year rag doll'n over the berm

Posted by: apb---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thump

The more I watch Chad Reed the more I like to see him get ruined by Stewart.

I'm with you on this -- I like to see close racing, but its really hard to pull for Reed to win, and I find myself rooting for Bubba whenever its a close race. Reed's words and actions just make him hard to like. But he really has stepped it up this year speed-wise, and on some tracks, he's been able to at least battle with JS for a little while..

Posted by: kmccune---------------------

I don't believe that he tried to take him out, aggressive block pass you bet. But I do think that he needs to start acting more professional. We will never know what Stewart said to him, he claims that he couldn't repeat it on TV??? Who knows. But Stewart passed him and ran away. Seems to me like he just got beat, can't be pissed at a guy to the point of physical contact for that.

Posted by: Jon K.---------------------

Watched it 12 times.

Yeah, Bubba should have backed down, because he KNEW Reed was going to enter tight and drift wide.

If he couldn't see that one coming, he needs to go back to "Racing 101".

Bubba's going to have to be smarter than that.

If you want to see a take-out move, dig up the old video of Windham vs Vuillemin.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

But he really has stepped it up this year speed-wise, and on some tracks, he's been able to at least battle with JS for a little while..

I'm not so sure that's the case ... IMHO, JS is just going fast enough to win, it's pretty obvious that there's a LOT more in the tank, as he showed this week, by running Reed down. After that, he just got a gap and maintained it; didn't pull away. When RC is in the mix? RC and JS leave Chad way back; JS has to step up to run with RC. I suppose we could argue that once he got caught, he (Chad) upped the pace? If that's the case, then he's got a lot bigger problem than lacking some speed.

Sooner or later he's going to realize that there are no more excuses and accept the fact that he can't run the pace required to be on the top step. If he'd just accept that, stop talking and just race, he could assume the underdog role and ride that for all it's worth. We all love underdogs.

Posted by: karterron---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thump

Well said.

I think the complaints on Chad are more to do with his whining cry baby speeches. I don't blame him for getting aggressive, that's the only shot he has. I blame him for the crybaby speech afterwards. Chad's a tool, always will be.

Posted by: karterron---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon K.

Watched it 12 times.

Yeah, Bubba should have backed down, because he KNEW Reed was going to enter tight and drift wide.

If he couldn't see that one coming, he needs to go back to "Racing 101".

Bubba's going to have to be smarter than that.

If you want to see a take-out move, dig up the old video of Windham vs Vuillemin.

Easy to say that when you don't enter corners at James speed and have no clue what the feels like, let alone how little reaction time there is.

Your the one that needs Racing 101.

Posted by: Chili---------------------

Anybody that thinks that is a block pass best get back to class. A block pass occurs at the apex of the turn when the other rider leaves the inside open. Essentially this is what Stewart would have done had he not got into the corner so much faster than Stewart. There is no way Stewart likely even saw Reed coming as it was a complete blindside. My guess is Reeds intention was to try to take Stewarts line away but that only works if your are at least close to the same speed which is not the case here.

Posted by: Jon K.---------------------

katerron,

You REALLY do not want to engage me on my experience or lack thereof. Fast as Bubba? No, I am not nor ever was.

But I got boots older than Stewart.

And I promise that I have been around an MX track enough times to understand how racing works. And that's an understatement.

One thing that I would change in my wording,

If he couldn't FEEL (rather than "see" as I originally stated) that one coming, he needs to go back to "Racing 101".

Posted by: Chili---------------------

Big deal I got underwear older than Stewart but I still have 20/20 vision.

Posted by: FruDaddy---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thump

So, you heard what Stewart said, because I couldn't. But I saw Stewart pull up next to RC and motion for Reed to stop. Typically RC and Stewart do give each other a pat on the back after a race, but it didn't happen this time as Stewart seemed to be ignoring RC. When Reed stopped, Stewarts helmet started moving quickly, which appeared to me to be heated conversation. I have a hard time believing that it was "no hard feelings". Apparently whatever was said upset Reed, but I do not agree with the pushing.

During the interview, when Stewart was asked what he said, he simply (and wisely) refused to even answer. Reed then said that it wasn't pretty and shouldn't be repeated.

For Reed to have been able to cut in front of Stewart in that turn, he must have been running faster than James at the time. Especially considering the fact that Stewart was in front of him 30 feet earlier. It did appear that, had no contact been made, Reed's line would have left 18-24 inches on the side of the track for Stewart to ride in, however, this part is pure speculation and very easily debatable. Stewart WOULD have done the same thing, remember the events leading up to the incident with Preston in Canada. I believe in was across the line from the inside, contact made, but that was probably just an incorrect speed calculation.

While I know that many people don't like Reed, for whatever reason, you should all notice that Stewart thinks that he owns the track, and the only other person worthy of riding on it is RC. While it is true that Stewart is the fastest full time rider right now, he should stop expecting everybody else to just lay down and take it. Last year I really enjoyed watching Stewart race, but now I am tiring of it and just waiting for him to screw up and break himself. I look forward to Villipoto moving up so that we might know if he can match speed with the almighty green 7.

And Okie, my glasses are roughly the color of titanium.

Posted by: karterron---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon K.

katerron,

You REALLY do not want to engage me on my experience or lack thereof. Fast as Bubba? No, I am not nor ever was.

But I got boots older than Stewart.

And I promise that I have been around an MX track enough times to understand how racing works. And that's an understatement.

One thing that I would change in my wording,

If he couldn't FEEL (rather than "see" as I originally stated) that one coming, he needs to go back to "Racing 101".

TRUST me, you don't have anyone beat on experience. Your logic is just flat WRONG. You want us to think James was at fault for not seeing it, or not reacting too it. Fact is, at the speed they are going and where James was in that turn, NOBODY could have done anything different than Bubba did. That was all on Chad, nobody else is too blame.

With that said, as I posted earlier, I don't blame Chad for trying. That's the only way he will ever beat Bubba. About time he grew a pair. Won't do him any good, Bubba showed he has way more in the tank when needed.

Posted by: weimedog---------------------

I happen to enjoy talent. And James Stewart certainly has that! I understand the phsycology a bit and also part of Stewarts act is convincing both himself and all who are willing to engage of his abilities & attitude...And I like watching that too! Just one very talented and enthusiastic young fellow who's yet again pushing the bounds of this sport and it a lot of fun to watch...ANY one who's EVER raced has to be in awe of this kids ability same as we were with Hannah's ability, RC's heart, and Everts tenacity...its what makes this sport great.

Reed? obviously one of the fastest in the world right now. Just as Stewart had to endure the last two years with RC...Reed has to deal with Stewart. (Poor sucker..Reed had to deal with RC in his prime too!) He's got to feel snake bit. But this also isn't new...what about K-dub? Perinal second place rider. You can go back and see year after year those who didn't have "it" but were amazing riders...we need REEDS too so Stewart has someone worth beating! Villipoto is the next K-dub..having to move into the big league when Stewarts there..Alessi the next Reed. Third place on a good day.

Posted by: KX250Dad---------------------

Had CR wished to take JS out intentionally take a look at the start. CR has speed and position and should he desired he could have continued to swing the turn wide, pushed JB off the track and over/thru the tuff blocks. See it frequently when it doesn't involve the top 5. Still think JBS would have caught him and the results would have been the same.

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

I think they both were in the wrong and John Dowd should have won.

Posted by: SpDyKen---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRpredator

I think they both were in the wrong and John Dowd should have won.

I think Doug Henry deserved the win.

B.T.W., on a very serious note, I have read an internet "rumor" that D.H. suffered a hard crash this weekend and speculation is that he may be seriously injured. This is one of those times I really hope that I have heard a false rumor! See - http://www.cyclenews.com/ShowStory.asp?HeadlineID=10528 or, http://www.supermotojunkie.com/show...2487#post272487 for more information about this.

Posted by: Jon K.---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRpredator

I think they both were in the wrong and John Dowd should have won.

I can get behind that.

They each thought the other would back down. High stakes game of "Chicken". Funny thing about playing chicken . . . . .

Posted by: Chili---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpDyKen

I think Doug Henry deserved the win.

B.T.W., on a very serious note, I have read an internet "rumor" that D.H. suffered a hard crash this weekend and speculation is that he may be seriously injured.

Need to be a registered user to see your link but I posted this earlier today.

http://dirtrider.net/forums3/showthread.php?t=147940

Posted by: Micahdawg---------------------

Not that anyone will give a chit, but this is what I think:

If Reed wanted to take out Bubba....why wouldn't he just follow him into the turn wide...with greater speed, and stuff him into the tuff blocks like Lawrence did to Villopoto? My guess is because he didn't want to take out Bubba.

What I take from it was Reeds only chance and coming out in front was to cut inside and diagonally across Bubba's line. This would force Bubba to chop the throttle to avoid contact. Is it malicious? I dunno...it's done plenty of times....even to -gasp- Reed. And in most cases, Reed, and others will slow down to avoid a potential wreck. Agressive? Hell yeah. Malicious? Dirty? I dunno.

Bubba just refused to slow down...he rolled the dice, they went down. How can you guys really read any more into it than that? They went into the turn with no contact, the only two ways they could have avoided coming out with no contact was for Reed to not cut across bubbas line (read, LINE, not front WHEEL) or for Bubba to let off. But no, it's Reeds fault? Whatever.

Bubba checked Reed up earlier in the race with as much contact. Was that malicious or dirty? Or just agressive?

I think it was racing....I think they should have left it out there....and I think Reed was gonna go back to his tent to b*tch about it. But Bubba just had to have a little discussion about it. So I don't blame either of em. It's just racing and Reed could be making far more desperate (and blatant) "cheap shots" at a win.

Posted by: SpDyKen---------------------

Anybody remember, in last weeks Atlanta race, Bubbles' pass on C.R. coming onto the straight - away? J.S had the entire length of the starting straightaway to get by Chad. Instead of motoring by with the momentum he gained charging hard out of the corner, He pushed Reed all the way to the edge of the track exiting the corner, and then gave him a hard "elbow bump," leaning his whole bike & body into Chad until he had to back off or crash. From my view, (both at the track & on the T.V.,) it was totally intentional and equally unnecessary by Bubba.

If you ride like that, you are going to get knocked down! I guess it keeps us all entertained and busy posting here.

As much as I would really like to be admiring B.S.(I LOVE using his initials!) for his unquestionable talent & speed, I just can't get past his arrogant, full of himself attitude!

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpDyKen

As much as I would really like to be admiring [Bubba] . . . for his unquestionable talent & speed, I just can't get past his arrogant, full of himself attitude!

hmmm . . . you could remove [Bubba] and put [Reed] in there and you'd have the reason peeps can't stand Chadwick.

Posted by: Ryone---------------------

Reed's a baby...
Reed has no heart...
Bubba is untouchable...
Blah, blah, blah...

At least there's something to talk about. I hope Reed and Bubba do this all year long. It makes for interesting races. Like Preston said of the first race in Canada... "No one knows that Ferry got fourth last weekend, but everyone knows that Bubba and I got together".

I hope they park each other every lap. Screw everybody's feelings... it's all about the fans, right? I'd pay money to watch these guys take each other out all night long.

Ryan

Posted by: Jon K.---------------------

[QUOTE=karterron]TRUST me, you don't have anyone beat on experience. QUOTE]

Wanna bet? Huh? Huh? Do ya??

OK, now I'm just trolling. But you did touch a nerve . . . . .

Posted by: kmccune---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chili

Anybody that thinks that is a block pass best get back to class. A block pass occurs at the apex of the turn when the other rider leaves the inside open.

A block pass is when you block or take away someones line in a turn, with the intent of passing them. It does not matter what part of the turn it happens in. Reed took Stewart's line and Stewart didn't back off. Seems pretty simple to this back of the room boy

Aggressive on both of their respective parts... Yup!

Posted by: HiG4s---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chili

Anybody that thinks that is a block pass best get back to class. A block pass occurs at the apex of the turn when the other rider leaves the inside open. Essentially this is what Stewart would have done had he not got into the corner so much faster than Stewart. There is no way Stewart likely even saw Reed coming as it was a complete blindside. My guess is Reeds intention was to try to take Stewarts line away but that only works if your are at least close to the same speed which is not the case here.

It is the same pass Bubba calls a block pass when he uses it on someone else.. Like when he tried it on RC when he first came to 250s, once RC did it back he stopped, like he did on MC, and MC planted him in the tuff blocks. Like he did to Tedesco IN PRACTICE back in Canada. If he is so fast, and he does appear to be, why does he resort to this crap? He still needs to grow up some. If he would just ignore Reed he would be better off.

Posted by: Chili---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by HiG4s

Like he did to Tedesco IN PRACTICE back in Canada. If he is so fast, and he does appear to be, why does he resort to this crap? He still needs to grow up some. If he would just ignore Reed he would be better off.

To clarify he landed on Tedesco in Toronto, didn't block pass him. Not sure how this became about what Stewart should do? Reed's the one bitching and moaning about it not Stewart.

Posted by: 2-Strokes 4-ever---------------------

I think Reed has all kinds of "heart".......just not enough speed, and he knows it. His take-out move on Bubbles was obvious as can be.....a frustated move. If Reed's gunna win, he needs someone to fall. I think dirty riding is cheap and easy, although exciting! Couldn't wait to see if James retaliated........would have been/and was exciting! Kudos to Stewart for acting with maturity. Sweet to see the vet win.

Posted by: karterron---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon K.

[QUOTE=karterron]TRUST me, you don't have anyone beat on experience. QUOTE]

Wanna bet? Huh? Huh? Do ya??

OK, now I'm just trolling. But you did touch a nerve . . . . .

I like touching nerves, that's the best way to get a decent back and forth on the internet.

On the experience thing, I hate to admit it but have been around this sport since the late 70's. First motocross race was in 1978 and I have raced on and off every since. If you got that beat, I will bow down.

Posted by: karterron---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chili

To clarify he landed on Tedesco in Toronto, didn't block pass him. Not sure how this became about what Stewart should do? Reed's the one bitching and moaning about it not Stewart.

The bitchin and crying is what I have a problem with also. I don't blame Reed for trying the pass, it's the only shot he has. Just shut the hell up with the crybaby crap afterwards. Grow a pair and tell Bubba, you do that again I put you in the fence. Or better yet, do what RC and MC did, punt his ass the next turn. Just stop crying about this stuff afterwards.

Posted by: Mxrider26x---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by karterron

Yea is that not what he did?

Posted by: karterron---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mxrider26x

Yea is that not what he did?

Uh, NO. He needs to tell Bubba that, not us. The viewing audience and fans in attendance wouldn't hear it. When Bubba motions you over, you tell him I will start doing to you what you do to me. He doesn't even need to do that, he should do like RC and MC did when Bubba gets dirty. Do it back and not say a word to the audience.

Reed doesn't need to cry to us, he just comes off as a crybaby when he does that. Settle it with Bubba on the track.

Chad Reed whines and cries more than any rider I can remember in the last 10 years in this sport.

Posted by: rickyd---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by karterron

Chad Reed whines and cries more than any rider I can remember in the last 10 years in this sport.

You never heard Matt Walker on the podium in SF a few years back, darn near broke down after getting boo'd by the crowd

Posted by: TheGrinch---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2-Strokes 4-ever

.... His take-out move on Bubbles was obvious as can be.....a frustated move.....

I don't know what race footage you people are watching, but it can't be the same footage I saw.

All I saw was Reed take the inside line to go under Stewart after Stewart attempted a block pass, & then Reed drifted across to the outside to block Stewarts line. Reed was clearly in front of Stewart before he drifted to the outside line & did not take out Stewart's front wheel. Stewart just failed to back off & the two collided & went down. It's that simple folks, stop calling it something it isn't.

Posted by: Mxrider26x---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by karterron

This is where you are wrong. If you did not see the confrontation, there was one, and I am sure that he said something there. Also, why does it matter if he honestly answered a question on the podium. Its better than being a little pus about it and trying to shy away from the question.

Posted by: karterron---------------------

I was at the race. The confrontation was all Bubba. Chad was a pus as usual. Bubba motions crybaby over and proceeds to yell at him and chump him out, rides away. As Bubba rides away, Chad shoves him.

That was some confrontation on Chad's part. He did his crying on the podium, not at Bubba. As usual, he just took it from Bubba.

Posted by: karterron---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickyd

You never heard Matt Walker on the podium in SF a few years back, darn near broke down after getting boo'd by the crowd

No, I don't remember that. Was it funny? Can't imagine that went over well.

Posted by: rickyd---------------------

If I remeber right, he parked Travis Preston into the finish line pole. WHen he made his podium speech, the entire crowd started boo'ing and he teared up

He could barely speak and all

Posted by: Chili---------------------

Matt was always a heart on the sleeve kind of guy.

Posted by: karterron---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickyd

If I remeber right, he parked Travis Preston into the finish line pole. WHen he made his podium speech, the entire crowd started boo'ing and he teared up

He could barely speak and all

I remember Travis getting parked into the finish line pole, I just forgot the speech I guess. Matt wasn't that big a star, having the fans against him could be a big detriment. After what he did when Alessi pulled his move at Glen Helen with Tedesco, I will always be a Matt fan. He's a good guy, even if he did have a pus moment before.

Posted by: Jon K.---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by karterron

[QUOTE=Jon K.] I like touching nerves, that's the best way to get a decent back and forth on the internet.

In your years of racing, karterron, did you ever have a really good race with someone? The kind of race where you pass one another six or eight times in a lap?

Typically, one rider will get a wheel under the other, dive into the corner underneath, and drift to the berm. The other rider (on the outside now) has the responsibility to know what is going on, shut down, cut under the blocking rider, and under the best case they will exit the corner side by side and race down the next straight, where the move will be repeated, most of the time with the roles reversed. It is thrilling to witness and even more thrilling to do. The stuff of dreams. I like to think of it as a sort of choreographed "dance".

These maneuvers can go on for several laps, though it is usually over after a couple of corners.

In this particular case, Bubba had already gotten a wheel under Reed. Reed, in the spirit of good racing, backed off, cut under, and drifted to the berm, just as Bubba should have expected. It was a long corner. I stand by my statement, if Bubba couldn't feel that one coming, he needs to go back to school.

Posted by: letsride24-7---------------------

That is one bad A$$ pic!!!

Posted by: KX250Dad---------------------

Nice pic Jon K, thanks for the memories. I was one of the first of my friends to get the "new" snap on visor...

I'm in alignment with your post(s), having posted similar only to be brutalized I've come to the conclusion non-MX/SX fellows view things one way while MX/SX race guys view things somewhat differently. It would be interesting to me if each post indicated their riding venue...

Jon K... Still race? I know this may be close to my last season... my goal is to ride to 60, think I'll be lucky to push 55 on the 2T... get a 4F and I think I can make it and also do away with the oxygen bottle.

Posted by: D Lafleur---------------------

You guys wouldnt believe some of Jon K's experiances. I happen to know about one season where Mr. K was completely "out of the box" did pretty good with that contraption if I remember correctly.

Posted by: Jon K.---------------------

Know what? I feel that I hi-jacked the thread by arguing about bona-fides with karterron.

Silly me.

I have deleted the pic, and any reference to myself.

KX250Dad, I have sent you an E-mail.

One more point. I am a big fan of Stewart. I just feel he needs to mature a bit more.

And I would have been very disappointed in Reed if he had just rolled over and gave the line to Stewart.

I watched the video a few more times. Looks to me like there was room for Stewart right up till the contact was made. The contact forced Reed out of his groove, he slid wide and under Stewart, and then it was all over.

Does anybody else see that?

(Edit) The above statement might be a stretch. I'm thinking Reed was going for the groove, but again, that might be a stretch. (Edit)

Posted by: karterron---------------------

I may be seeing this differently since I was actually at the race and got a good view of that corner. I thought I saw what I saw, and watching it on TV the next day confirmed it. That corner had 3 lines, one inside and two outside. One of the outside lines was deep by the main and nobody was using it. Bubba was line up to hit the other outside line. Chad went in behind him, accelerated to the apex and made contact. Really the only difference between what Chad did and what Bubba did to Chad a few weeks ago was the hard contact causing both to go down. Chad misjudged it and didn't leave Bubba any room to react or move. This one was all Chad, there was nothing Bubba could have done any differently and not gone down.

With that said and as I have already said. I don't blame Chad for what he did, it was a racing deal. A little agressive for early in the race, but not dirty. I blame Chad for crying like a little girl afterwards. Nobody wants to hear his whining, get out there and race this so called pace you claim you can run.

That groove you saw Jon was the second groove they ran in after the first one got too deep. Chad was trying to beat Bubba to that groove, he just didn't leave enough room for there not to be contact. Bubba had not time to react between lining himself up for the groove, having Chad accelerate too it, and stop before contact. We're talking split seconds, no seconds. Not Bubba's fault, it was Chad's mistake. I don't think he meant to take anyone out, but Chad misjudged it slightly.

Posted by: karterron---------------------

Jon, where's the pic. Send me PM with it. I want to see it. Here's a link to me circa 1983 with one of those snap on visors.

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j.../1983CR1252.jpg

Posted by: kawicam250---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by karterron

I may be seeing this differently since I was actually at the race and got a good view of that corner. I thought I saw what I saw, and watching it on TV the next day confirmed it. That corner had 3 lines, one inside and two outside. One of the outside lines was deep by the main and nobody was using it. Bubba was line up to hit the other outside line. Chad went in behind him, accelerated to the apex and made contact. Really the only difference between what Chad did and what Bubba did to Chad a few weeks ago was the hard contact causing both to go down. Chad misjudged it and didn't leave Bubba any room to react or move. This one was all Chad, there was nothing Bubba could have done any differently and not gone down.

With that said and as I have already said. I don't blame Chad for what he did, it was a racing deal. A little agressive for early in the race, but not dirty. I blame Chad for crying like a little girl afterwards. Nobody wants to hear his whining, get out there and race this so called pace you claim you can run.

That groove you saw Jon was the second groove they ran in after the first one got too deep. Chad was trying to beat Bubba to that groove, he just didn't leave enough room for there not to be contact. Bubba had not time to react between lining himself up for the groove, having Chad accelerate too it, and stop before contact. We're talking split seconds, no seconds. Not Bubba's fault, it was Chad's mistake. I don't think he meant to take anyone out, but Chad misjudged it slightly.

i agree with everything you said, karterron. but i do feel that Chad was desperate and tired of getting 2nd's and 3rd's. maybe he just wasnt using his head( which is probably it) or he wanted to end Bubba. i think he wanted to stuff him to show JBS that he has what it takes to run with him, but he seriously needs to work on his acting skills on the podium. about the comments concerning after the race. JBS was giving him a thumbs up with a big smile on his face, but then someone said something and they went at it. finally, James shows his maturity for his age by riding away, but not without a good-bye kiss from Reed

. i wasnt at the race, but i watched the the thing over and over again( i love DVR

). thats my perspective of what happened. but im very happy that James came back and passed him after it all. in the end, Chad still lost points to Bubba.

Posted by: karterron---------------------

Chad needs to keep riding agressive, not dirty but agressive. Let Bubb and Ricky know that he is not going to be their bitch anymore. Then he needs to shut the hell up with the crybaby stuff on the podium. Do like the Nascar boys do, I race him the way he races me type of lines. America loves underdogs, they hate cry babies.

I remember when Jeremy used to get booed for winning all the time. Then everyone loved him when Ricky came along and dominated. We all remember Ricky not being very well liked when he ran away with everything. We all loved Kdub and the Rock for being the underdog. None of these guys cried about what has happening.

Chad needs to get a PR guy or something. He comes off like a baby way too much. If that recent article I heard about was in fact referencing Chad, he may be a bigger jaggoff than we all know and not capable of getting it.

Posted by: Chili---------------------

Jon K if you're going to remove that photo from this thread how about you post it up somewhere else on the forum? It was a seriously cool photo and I love seeing the vintage stuff.

Karterron, cool shot

When you mentioned the snap on visor I had a vision of my Flat bill (duck bill) snap on visor with my Jofa facemask attached to my googles but I see you were a few years beyond that point there.

Posted by: karterron---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chili

Karterron, cool shot

When you mentioned the snap on visor I had a vision of my Flat bill (duck bill) snap on visor with my Jofa facemask attached to my googles but I see you were a few years beyond that point there.

Oh yea, remember those. I just don't have any photo's back that far. Open face helmets were all the rage when I started racing.

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

Open face helmets were all the rage Not after a face plant rips your jofa and one tooth off! Fullface were heavy,bulky and broke collarbones, byron 250b byron circa 79 to 81 #107 Honda

Posted by: just_a_rider---------------------

No body here would have tried the move either I guess? If the local tracks had a purse like that, we would all be overly aggressive and with more injuries to boot. $$$ <--- those signs mean alot.

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

This horse has been beaten pretty good,come on daytona and the stupid delayed broadcast of the lites!

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

stupid delayed broadcast of the lites

Did you read that somewhere?

Posted by: Chili---------------------

Lites are always delayed until the next week. At least Daytona will be live

Posted by: nephron---------------------

Quote:

you should all notice that Stewart thinks that he owns the track, and the only other person worthy of riding on it is RC.

....and the proverbial question is...AND?

Get used to it. Stewart rules. Ever since he was uphilling triples on an 80 that no one could clear on a 250, he has ruled. It's over.

I tell you what. I'll give Reed some Valium, and wake him up after the @#$^ season's over.

Posted by: Jon K.---------------------

Here is the pic, if anyone would like to see it.

http://www.dirtrider.net/forums3/sh...324#post1164324

Posted by: FruDaddy---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by nephron

Did you stop at that point? It doesn't matter how fast he is, he needs to realize that the other riders aren't obligated to pull over and let him by. It is their job to try to beat him, whether they can or not, they must try. It's about time soembody other the RC decides to hold a line, or even take his away, when they see hm coming. It would be nice to see Windham and Tedesco doing the same thing, but they seem to have accepted 3-5 place, and are way too happy to get the holeshot, lead a lap or two, and/or stand on the podium as the second loser when it's all over.

Reed may not be as fast as Stewart, but I think that he's the only other one out there every week (RC is part time) that really wants to win.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

It's about time soembody other the RC decides to hold a line, or even take his away, when they see hm coming. It would be nice to see Windham and Tedesco doing the same thing, but they seem to have accepted 3-5 place

So. You are 1-2 seconds a lap slower week in and week out. You think you're only chance is to block pass or take a line? What's the point? The guy can come from last place and just catch and pass you again. I'm all about aggressive, competitive racing (ie, RC and JS). But Reed just doesn't have the speed to hope a block pass will win a race for him.
A block by Reed is nothing but desperation, he should know by now, it's a waste of time.

Posted by: hayes214---------------------

so let me get this right if reed block passes it is not right because he is not able to keep up. but it is ok for james to do it even if he is 2 seconds a lap faster? lets look at this now how many other riders in just this year has james had trouble with? more than one or two for sure.It is racing and a block pass is what you do to race. if what you say is true then every rider should just pull over and let sir james thru? maybe you forgot what was the points last year did bubba just blow everyone away, i dont think so he is good but he needs to take lessons from rc, windham.

Posted by: Micahdawg---------------------

Quote:

So. You are 1-2 seconds a lap slower week in and week out. You think you're only chance is to block pass or take a line? What's the point?

Plain and simple, the point, is to win.

Posted by: Micahdawg---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by hayes214

if what you say is true then every rider should just pull over and let sir james thru?

Actually I think Oki would rather have each rider evaluted to see "how good they are". Place Bubba up front, Reed behind him, then the rest in their respective ranking. Parade them around for 20 laps, single file, then they can all claim the spots that they deserve. Oh, and it'll be much safer...eliminating that dangerous passing stuff that most riders shouldn't even be attempting anyway.

Sounds like a hoot!!!!!

Posted by: hayes214---------------------

like you said it is racing not a parade

Posted by: FruDaddy---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okiewan

So basically you are saying that Reed should just give up and accept defeat? Would you? Would you want you children to? If that's the case, then what is the point of even showing up?

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

So basically you are saying that Reed should just give up and accept defeat? Would you? Would you want you children to? If that's the case, then what is the point of even showing up?

If taking out another rider is the only chance for a win? Maybe it's time to re-evaluate his goals/expectations? Chad's continued podium frustration/excuses/crying, etc., seem to be due to his delusions of being able to run with Stewart. Does he quit? Nope. He continues doing the best he can, bank the millions, retire, go back to Australia a hero and live happily ever-after. But, beating himself up, making excuses and (potentially) relying on taking someone out, hoping for a crash, etc., really isn't going to work. Tellin' ya, he needs to cash in on the underdog thing and leave the whining behind.

(BTW, I'll put the fishing pole away now, sometimes it's just to easy

)

Posted by: HiG4s---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okiewan

So. You are 1-2 seconds a lap slower week in and week out. You think you're only chance is to block pass or take a line? What's the point? .

So. You are 1-2 seconds a lap faster week in and week out. You don't need to block pass to take a line? What's the point? That is what I'd lilke to know.

So Chad is doing it out of desperation, that means Bubba is doing it for what reason. Just to be a jerk? And his Eddie Haskel act on the podium is getting old. "Gee Mrs Cleaver, it was just all good clean racing, I'd never do anything to hurt the Beev'".

If he would stop doing stuipd things, shut up and race I'd still be rooting for him.

Posted by: kx__ken---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by nephron

....and the proverbial question is...AND?

Get used to it. Stewart rules. Ever since he was uphilling triples on an 80 that no one could clear on a 250, he has ruled. It's over.

Did he "rule" last year? Seems to me this guy has nothing but failed attempts at a AMA big boy title. I wouldn't call that ruling since he was on an 80. I have no doubt the guy will win many titles but he certainly hasn't ruled since he's been on big bikes if he did he'd have a couple big bike titles by now.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

So. You are 1-2 seconds a lap faster week in and week out. You don't need to block pass to take a line? What's the point? That is what I'd lilke to know.

I suppose you could ask RC? I can recall several EPIC block passes/Brake Checks by the GOAT.

Posted by: FruDaddy---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okiewan

I suppose you could ask RC? I can recall several EPIC block passes/Brake Checks by the GOAT.

Thought you were putting that pole away.

Since we are bringing up the distant past; do you remember listening to Stewart whine that his 250 couldn't keep up with Ricky's thumper outdoors? Then when he got a 450 of his own, he had to resort to landing on Ricky's shoulder, and still couldn't keep up in the sunshine. Same game, different day, different player.

Posted by: hayes214---------------------

that is not what the point. you are saying it is pointless for reed to block pass because he is slower. so if james is so much faster why does he block pass. it is part of racing not matter if you are slower or faster.james will win some titles and he is very fast. but rc block passes and stewart are far from being the same.you can block pass and be clean and you can block pass and try to take some one out which i have seen bubba do more than once

Posted by: just_a_rider---------------------

I think they should outlaw rubbing in all motorsports that way we could all watch a boring race where one man laps the field.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by just_a_rider

I think they should outlaw rubbing in all motorsports that way we could all watch a boring race where one man laps the field.

So who are you mad at for "rubbing"? Stewart or 2nd place Reedy?

The fast guy rubs? It's a statement. The slower guy rubs? It's desperation. Simple.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Man, I thought I brought that bobber in?

Posted by: hayes214---------------------

if you are faster why rub you should be in front?

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

Look,when racing it is important to hold your lines,shortest distance and fastest corner line,this is racing to your best capabilities. Now someone comes up to you,it pushes you. He does what he can to pass you,his problem,why waste time braking up or blocking to the inside,a corner from the finish yes,first lap are you kidding me! For what its worth I have seen this type of rider before! But you get passed and try and keep up and watch what they are doing. This is how you get faster and live to talk about it. Faster riders passing slower riders can be challenging and dangerous,he has to go faster than you and in crappier lines. Crashing with a moving object in certain situations it is ill advised to back off the throttle,transfer momentum to the other guy,they do not teach that in drivers ed! Time to change your mind in a corner,while you are in reality planning the next obstacle is a joke too! Maybe they could bust out some tea and crackers!

Posted by: Red Mamba---------------------

[QUOTE=

It's Chad Reed who thinks that he owns the race truck even if he can't win a clean race.I recal when he called I Tedesco a chump, a #4 guy who didn't wanna get out of his way fast enough for him to try catch JS/RC.

Posted by: Mxrider26x---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Mamba

[QUOTE=

It's Chad Reed who thinks that he owns the race truck even if he can't win a clean race.I recal when he called I Tedesco a chump, a #4 guy who didn't wanna get out of his way fast enough for him to try catch JS/RC.

Chad Reed also doesnt fly around the track every race with no regard for anyone else but himself.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

Chad Reed also doesnt fly around the track every race with no regard for anyone else but himself.

Maybe he should? Maybe it = win?

Posted by: Mxrider26x---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okiewan

Maybe he should? Maybe it = win?

Is that worth hurting other riders?

Posted by: nephron---------------------

Yes.

Quote:

if what you say is true then every rider should just pull over and let sir james thru?

Again, you've answered your own question. ...yes. The result is the same.

I'm kidding, obviously. I think what I'm trying to say, with severe irony, is that yes. I'd love Chad Reed to race aggressively, as in the last 1/2 of the 03 season against RC. He was actually, at that point, faster than RC. We'd all like to see it. But he's either lost a step, or everyone else is faster, and yet he continues to try to win pulling b.s. stunts like this, and then whining about it. Nobody wants to see that crap. At least I don't.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mxrider26x

Is that worth hurting other riders?

As I'm no Champion, can't tell ya. BUT you could ask just about every champ in the sport's history .... they've all parked, landed on or generally punted people along the way.

Posted by: FruDaddy---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okiewan

...you could ask just about every champ in the sport's history .... they've all parked, landed on or generally punted people along the way.

Yet it's wrong for Austrailians to do it?

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by FruDaddy

Yet it's wrong for Austrailians to do it?

Dude, that's some serious reach, lol. You can do better. Please try again.

He's more than welcome to punt JS imho... we just saw it and the result. He got spanked... again. Followed by is whiner speech (again) on the podium.

Like I said a couple hundred times... if he'd just keep his mouth shut, it would all be good. But noooooo

Posted by: Mxrider26x---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okiewan

Dude, that's some serious reach, lol. You can do better. Please try again.

Yeah that is almost as much of a reach as someone earlier who compared satan to James Stewart.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mxrider26x

Yeah that is almost as much of a reach as someone earlier who compared satan to James Stewart.

Learn to recognize humor young lad.

I've GOT to get more of these lures

Posted by: FruDaddy---------------------

I was just reading that post, then I came to this one. Okie, ar you running out of Stewart praise material? Have you now realized that Reed is and has done nothing that Stewart has not done (this includes the whining), but don't want to accept it? It's OK, we all make mistakes. Even the great green hope (actually, he makes a lot of them).

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

Even the great green hope

Humm.. I don't think I'll go there.

The bottom line:
Stewart brake checks/blocks Reed? Statement.
Reed brake checks/blocs Stewart? Desperation.

Posted by: Mxrider26x---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okiewan

Humm.. I don't think I'll go there.

The bottom line:
Stewart brake checks/blocks Reed? Statement.
Reed brake checks/blocs Stewart? Desperation.

Maybe he is just trying to race with Stewart. I dont know that wouldnt be the worst thing that has happened to this sport.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mxrider26x

Maybe he is just trying to race with Stewart. I dont know that wouldnt be the worst thing that has happened to this sport.

No question about that ... look at this thread

Longest most debated MX/SX thread in a LONG time. Well, since the internet hated RC anyway. Yup, the aggressive, dangerous, cocky kid that thinks he can take down the big dog.... The more stuff changes, the more it stays the same.

Posted by: FruDaddy---------------------

What, somebody trying to race during a race? It just can't happen.
If you aren't Ricky Carmichael, then you are not allowed to make any moves that might slow the Great Bubba. He is the next GOAT? His desitiny is to win the next 10 championships uncontested. He will sweep both indoors and outdoors, with no losses in heats or motos. He will lap the entire field, and as he comes around, all other riders must pull off the track and lay their bikes down, for their finishing position is carved in granite at that point.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by FruDaddy

What, somebody trying to race during a race? It just can't happen.
His desitiny is to win the next 10 championships uncontested. He will sweep both indoors and outdoors, with no losses in heats or motos. He will lap the entire field, and as he comes around, all other riders must pull off the track and lay their bikes down, for their finishing position is carved in granite at that point.

You just described the last several years? I'd be willing to bet you'll find more incidents of RC raping Reed ....

But hey, if someone comes along with the speed and doesn't need the takeouts, hoping for a DNF, etc, THEN it really will be good. Until then, the only question is, will James crash and Reed win and tell us how a lesser man would have given up.

Posted by: FruDaddy---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okiewan

Humm.. I don't think I'll go there.

The bottom line:
Stewart brake checks/blocks Reed? Statement.
Reed brake checks/blocs Stewart? Desperation.

Wait, what statement is he trying to make? If his unlimited speed and ability to come back from a 10 lap deficit still leaves room for any statements to be made, then he needs to learn a new language. No, he must be saying "I am an arrogant a$$, do something about it".

Reed's "desperation" says "I am here and I want the title, If you screw up, it's mine".

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

So let me get this straight... oh wait, you think the two of them falling is JS' fault. Never mind. How can we debate further? Are you saying that the brake check when JS caught him (again) is somehow NOT racing, but the earlier incident is? Oh my, this is all too confusing.

Going for 140 posts/replies.

Posted by: FruDaddy---------------------

When did I ever even addres the later brake check? My guess is that he missed, perhaps Reed saw it coming and avoided the contact, he does make far fewer mistakes than Stewart.

I am saying that Stewart played his part in the fall, look closer at the video and watch his front tire. More importantly, I am saying that Reed has done nothing that Stewart hasn't done on more than one occasion.
I am saying that Reed gets paid to try to win, just like every other factory rider, only he actually does his job (the others let it go and try for third).
I am saying that simply because Stewart is faster, he is not justified for pulling the same maneuvers that you are criticizing Reed for. If it's OK for Stewie, then it is OK for everybody.
And finally, I am saying that Stewart would be whining (again) too if he weren't leading the points.

Posted by: FruDaddy---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okiewan

Going for 140 posts/replies.

If you include the Whose fault poll, (47) then this in nearing 200(actually 177) in less than a week.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by FruDaddy

I am saying that simply because Stewart is faster, he is not justified for pulling the same maneuvers that you are criticizing Reed for.

I'M saying, I don't care what Reed does ... The ONLY thing I don't like about Reed is that he opens his mouth and speaks. Take a lesson from the GOAT** ... "I got beat, he was faster today", smile big, take a swig of your "sports drink" and move on. But nooooo.... there's always an excuse. There's even the "My shoulder hurts, my mouth was full of sand, but NO EXCUSES"

LOL!!!!

** As you may recall, RC used to get SLAMMED weekly for his less than correct, cocky, I rule the world podium speeches. Funny tho, no one ever complained about him "pushing around" Reed every week.

Posted by: Mxrider26x---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okiewan

** As you may recall, RC used to get SLAMMED weekly for his less than correct, cocky, I rule the world podium speeches. Funny tho, no one ever complained about him "pushing around" Reed every week.

Partly, because before the 4 stroke era of supercross, they pushed eachother around equally.

Posted by: hayes214---------------------

getting beat clean is one thing. buuba trys to take out front tires.when has bubba not whined and cried. when he took out preston it was not his fault even though it was completly. how bout ivan once again not his fault.he is out of control and want this so bad he willtake out anyone use all the dirty passes he can to get it. then he will complain when he gets it back. i say go chad stand up to the prince no one should just hand over a race

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mxrider26x

Partly, because before the 4 stroke era of supercross, they pushed eachother around equally.

can we let go of the two-stroke thing already? McGrath handed everyone's ass to them on a regular basis, then RC did it, now Stewart is. Doesn't matter what everyone is riding.

again, for all you whiny two-stroke girly-man losers:

http://www.dirtrider.net/gallery/fi...ahmbulance2.jpg

Posted by: kawicam250---------------------

this thread is going to keep growing even after Daytona

. ahhhh, the Waaahmbulance, makes me smile just thinking about it

Posted by: Micahdawg---------------------

Quote:

The fast guy rubs? It's a statement. The slower guy rubs? It's desperation. Simple.

The slower guy winning the championship? That’s a statement. A statement that says “racing is not what you think it is.”

Posted by: kawicam250---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Micahdawg

The slower guy winning the championship? That’s a statement. A statement that says “racing is not what you think it is.”

true, but thats a stretch. JBS is on his way to have two #1 plates this year, i doubt that Chad, even with his take-out moves, will pull it off.

Posted by: Micahdawg---------------------

Yeah, it is a stretch, but it wasn't that long ago when Chad (without his takeout moves) earned Bubba a 5th place spot. JBS has had to claw his way back 2 or 3 rounds now and we're just over the halfway point. The onus is on JBS.

Posted by: Jon K.---------------------

[QUOTE=Micahdawg]The slower guy winning the championship? That’s a statement. QUOTE]

Guts and determination win out over talent?

Yeah, that happens from time to time. That's why the call it racing.

Posted by: hayes214---------------------

yep james may win the plates,and if he doesnt then what? are we going to whine and blame it on chad and anyone else that tries to race with him?

Posted by: kawicam250---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by hayes214

yep james may win the plates,and if he doesnt then what? are we going to whine and blame it on chad and anyone else that tries to race with him?

speak for yourself

Posted by: hayes214---------------------

oh ok thanks

Posted by: Solid State---------------------

Face it. The only way Reed can realistically win the title from now on is to punt Bubba off the track whenever possible. If its towards the end of the race Bubba may get second place. If sooner, maybe Bubba's bike will break or not start - even better for Reed.

If Reed doesn't play this game, he will lose and Bubba will win buy huge margins - ala RC - and we will be looking farther back into the pack for anything interesting to watch: BORING.

Bring it on Reed. More banging. More punting. More slapping after the race. More crying on the podium!! More Erin!!

Real racing is in the outdoors anyway.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

Real racing is in the outdoors anyway.

True dat! SX, for me, is just "better than nothing".

Posted by: Philip---------------------

Now that's what we needed Pred!!!

That's my biggest complaint with Reed is the complaining and excuses. Just shut up and do what you have to. I have always liked RC and he was not always clean, just ask Roncada. That stuff does not bother me, just don't Bitch about it.

Posted by: kawicam250---------------------

you said it, MX is so much more exciting to watch than SX. as said a long time ago: SX is a ballet, MX is a war

. true it be.

Posted by: dirtman2527---------------------

Man there has always been talk of the pass that was put on Stewart on the first lap of St. Louis but what gets me going is every time Stewart puts on an aggressive move he is looked upon as trying to take out the competition! If you look at lap times anywhere Stewart is by far the fastest! So for Reed to be saying he is tired of being pushed around is stupid. Maybe he should start riding a little harder, cause it is kinda hard for RC and Stewart to push him around all the time when they are both 10 to 20 seconds ahead of him! To Reed I just say ride harder or stop complaining about the bottom step of the podium!

Posted by: Micahdawg---------------------

Yeah. What he said. And that goes for Ferry, Windham, Byrne, Voss, Tedesco, Vuillemin, Preston, Millsaps, Carpenter, Wey, Ramsey, Evans, Sorby, Gibson, Marsack, Johnson, and Rivas. Ride harder! Look at all the benefits. If you ride harder, you win. But they don't ride harder, so they must not want to win. They must like getting lapped or something. I don't get it.

Posted by: kawicam250---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Micahdawg

Yeah. What he said. And that goes for Ferry, Windham, Byrne, Voss, Tedesco, Vuillemin, Preston, Millsaps, Carpenter, Wey, Ramsey, Evans, Sorby, Gibson, Marsack, Johnson, and Rivas. Ride harder! Look at all the benefits. If you ride harder, you win. But they don't ride harder, so they must not want to win. They must like getting lapped or something. I don't get it.

you cant just go tell a baby to walk, or a dog to do a backflip. they are professional racers, faster than me, you, and most everyone else. most of them( most, mind you) are riding to the best of their ability, but sometimes its just not enough to get on the podium. Ferry and Windham have been riding great this year, especially Ferry. dont question professional racer's speed, neither you or i know what is going on is their lives that could possibly affect their speed.

Posted by: kawicam250---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirtman2527

Man there has always been talk of the pass that was put on Stewart on the first lap of St. Louis but what gets me going is every time Stewart puts on an aggressive move he is looked upon as trying to take out the competition! If you look at lap times anywhere Stewart is by far the fastest! So for Reed to be saying he is tired of being pushed around is stupid. Maybe he should start riding a little harder, cause it is kinda hard for RC and Stewart to push him around all the time when they are both 10 to 20 seconds ahead of him! To Reed I just say ride harder or stop complaining about the bottom step of the podium!

i think that JBS beat Reed by over 40 sec.

Posted by: dirtman2527---------------------

That is just it! They are professional racers and their personal lives should not have anything to do with their riding! If you or I got paid to do what we love, RACING!, then that is all we would keep in mind on race day! Yes these guys are really fast but they get paid ( and paid very well!) to do just that, ride fast not whine about getting pushed around!

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

Could be its not anything magical,its just their present capabilities,CR is done,he don't even ride the Nationals anymore! Done,got nothing else,here is an idea,let JS be his worst enemy. The lap times say it all,black and white.RC was able to push JS,and we will not see a good mud race in my lifetime,again!

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