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2007 AMA Congress
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Posted by: lwsmithjr---------------------

Word from Ohio appears to be that a version of last years "Fair Displacement " rule has passed.

Proposed class structure for Amateur Racing would be
125 CC (Two and Four Stroke)
250 CC (Two and Four Stroke)
Open (125cc - 700cc)

There were also some slight modifications to the age restrictions in the youth classes.

Please note I have not seen this in print but was told by a promoter who was present.

Maybe 12 months of complaining had an impact..........

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

Unbelievable! No I mean it, after last year!

Posted by: snb73---------------------

If I am reading this correctly, it means displacements would be equal for 2 and 4 strokes?

http://home.ama-cycle.org/congress/...det.asp?pid=952

The reason for the proposal is interesting too. Could it mean we really have a voice.

Posted by: FruDaddy---------------------

It didn't last year, the powers that be killed it despite the fact that it passed congress.

Posted by: wardy---------------------

this year will be different I have confidence in that. there was a whole different attitude about this rule passage. NO complaints, from anyone, we all worked together and passed a good class structure. it took 4.5 hours last friday. There were people in the room that make things happen. Also some of the very trustees who will vote on this were there also, and it was clear we voted it in with no disention.

But like I heard out there also from the AMA 's new president, "proofs in the puddin" so I will hold him to that and see if congress's rule on classification will pass.

please note last years proposal which failed was submitted by me, LOL i truely believe they didn't expect it to pass or have support that it had. This years proposal was submitted by ama staff, and that in it's self leads me to believe it will make it.

www.amadistrict17.com has the proposals and the list of results posted on the home page.

a new points per finish for advancement passed also. trying to make it more fair.

see what happens the trustees vote on this in november I do believe.

wardy

class stucture proposal you are looking for is number 59 & 72 it was ammended 9 times, but it kept the main reason for being.....parity. it's a good rule........

Posted by: FruDaddy---------------------

Wardy, I knew that you would be along to address this. Thanks for your insight on the climate of the rule makers, it makes speculation much easier for the rest of us.

Posted by: Zenith---------------------

Any word on this? When in November is the vote?

Posted by: wardy---------------------

November 17th and as soon as I know I will post it. I think it will pass but in my conversation yesterday with an AMA staff member he told me there still maybe some static from the "corporate" side of the trustees. If this happens that is doesn't pass, there will be a bigger crap storm then they had last year.

lets hope they pass it, its the right thing to do.

Posted by: rpm12505---------------------

WOW I hope it sticks this time. But it'll really hack most people off here in the northeast. Everyone in MX is on a 4stroke. The occasional sighting is either poor foke or the grenaded 4s back-up plan.
Thanks to all that fought for this to be.

Posted by: Zenith---------------------

Yep I hope it passes as well and that it spreads to the FIM. Although I appreciate the extra cc with these 144/153/285 rules it's really not good for the sport to have so many displacements and will probably kill two strokes even faster with so many different bikes out there and the cost of overbores etc. It makes no sense for there to be a youth class where 125cc is the max, a 125 class where 125cc is the max and a Lites class where 144/153 is the max. One capacity means one set of tools for manufacturers which has got to be better for consumers.

Good luck!

Posted by: Zenith---------------------

Anywhere we can get the results, it's killing me to find out

Posted by: FruDaddy---------------------

Be patient young grasshopper, Wardy will tell all in time.

Posted by: wardy---------------------

I have called a few peeps and no return calls yet, I hope to know tommorow and will post as soon as i know. heck AMA should have it on the site tuesday at the latest, they did last year.

Posted by: SpDyKen---------------------

Thanks! I too am curious to see what the outcome of this year's AMA corporate shell game will reveal.

As usual, I do not expect much good to come from it, despite what I've heard. Incompetence runs deep at the AMA H.Q.

Posted by: wardy---------------------

I expect the opposite, I really believe they will pass the rule changes and make more changes that will get this whole deal moving better. the pure example of keeping this completely controled and quiet leads me to believe they may be working together now better then ever? LOL thats either good or bad? have to see. they are going to post on the AMA site, I would bet today or tommorow, they did the same last year.

My gut feeling is the class structure we passed at congress is a go. lets hope so.

Posted by: flynbryan---------------------

So tell me if I am understanding this right.....

125cc 2-stroke bikes would race only against 125cc 4-stroke bikes? Same story for 250cc 2-stroke bikes? They will only race against 250cc 4-stroke bikes? More or less putting the 450's into an "open" class like the 500cc open class of the old 2-stroke days? I assume this to try and make things more fair for the 2-stroke riders?

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by flynbryan

So . . . I assume this to try and make things more fair for the 2-stroke riders?

gotta keep the luddites happy

Posted by: lwsmithjr---------------------

This is how it was proposed by congress to the board...

Amateur Classes
bike must have a 53" wheelbase except woman's classes

CLASS NAME DISPLACEMENT RULES
125cc 122cc - 125cc 2-Stroke
250cc 122cc-250cc
Open 122cc-Open cc
14-24 122cc-Open cc
Plus 25 122cc-Open cc
Vet Plus 30 122cc-Open cc
Vet Plus 35 122cc-Open cc
Senior Plus 40 122cc-Open cc
Senior Plus 45 122cc-Open cc
Senior Plus 50 122cc-Open cc
Women (12+) 99cc-250cc

Posted by: Zenith---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRpredator

gotta keep the luddites happy

As two stroke riders surely had to put up with in the late 60s. Get over it, people want choice.

Posted by: wardy---------------------

yep that looks like the structure. pred it's not "just" about 2 stroke vrs 4stroke. look at that class structure again. It allows a 250 rider the ability to ride open and NOT have to buy another bike. This is huge! instead of dad spending part of the kids college fund, he only has to have junior on one bike. Hell a good rider on a 125 could race three class sizes.

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

Don't get me wrong, I'm all about saving money and whatnot, but if you're going to do that maybe they could cut about three or four of the eleventy-brazilian classes that are raced throughout the Loretta Lynn's week, eh?

The whole amateur MX thing needs some kind of overhaul. I mean, cripes, you have all those classes for everyone, but only two or three womens classes. I'll start racing again when they have the "you gotta weigh more than your bike" class.

Posted by: RM_guy---------------------

Soooo...Pred wants an overweight women's class so he can feel comfortable racing again

Posted by: wardy---------------------

HEY I resemble that remark~! We tried that 220+ class back in the day, didn't know so many "VAIN" mx guys on the planet! Funny to talk about but NO ONE signed up, cept maybe bill?

i aggree on the classes but realize that MX sports decides on all those "stock, purple bikes on tuesday" classes. normal mx on every sunday don't run all that stuff. hell a National normal championship (amatuer) could be run in three days, not a week, but LOL what kind of money and exsposure would that make? Look at the way that whole thing has gone, and for that matter, mini-O's (2100 riders this week), Branson (1800+ riders), actually sign ups but no matter it's huge business, in fact so huge that it pretty much "runs" amatuer mx. We still have alot of classes. There will be 2 "female" classes, adult and kids, the whole structure is streamlined. Maybe not enough for us "old" 8 class on sunday types, but it is what it is.

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by RM_guy

Soooo...Pred wants an overweight women's class so he can feel comfortable racing again

yes, because I might be able to compete, then.

Where's my bra?

Posted by: cancanman---------------------

Has there been any updates?

Posted by: wardy---------------------

not yet i just checked like 20 minutes ago
it should be any hour or day now................

Posted by: wardy---------------------

this was posted on another board and i am pretty sure it has been approved since the author of this e mail was holiday

CLASS NAME DISPLACEMENT RULES
125cc 122cc - 125cc 2-Stroke
250cc 122cc-250cc
Open 122cc-Open cc
14-24 122cc-Open cc
Plus 25 122cc-Open cc
Vet Plus 30 122cc-Open cc
Vet Plus 35 122cc-Open cc
Senior Plus 40 122cc-Open cc
Senior Plus 45 122cc-Open cc
Senior Plus 50 122cc-Open cc
Women (12+) 99cc-250cc

51cc 4-6 Stock Class 1
51cc 7-8 Stock Class 2
51cc 4-8 Stock Oil Injected Class 3
51cc 4-8 Stock Multi Speed Class 4

65cc 7-9 59cc-65cc 2-Stroke
65cc 10-11 59cc-65cc 2-Stroke
65cc 7-11 59cc-65cc 2-Stroke

85cc 9-11 79cc-85cc 2-Stroke
85cc 12-15 79cc-85cc 2-Stroke

Supermini 12-16 79cc-112cc 2-Stroke/75-150cc 4-Stroke,
Max. front wheel 19"
Max. rear wheel 16"
Max. wheelbase 52"

Schoolboy 12-16 86cc - 125cc 2-Stroke/75cc-150cc 4 -stroke , Minimum rear wheel 16", Minimum front wheel 19"
Schoolboy 14-16 122cc-250cc Minimum 53" wheelbase (No minicycles or Superminis)

Girls 9-15 79cc-105cc 2-Stroke
Max. rear wheel 16" Max. front wheel 19"
Max. wheelbase 52"

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

Now this time is really, really for real? No back stabbing? No long term bs? This is it?

Posted by: wardy---------------------

this is done. If an AMa staff member says it is done, then I would believe it to be done.

2008 will determine if this class structure is viable. The big races will show if this deal is fair and level playing field. If it does it will survive a long time, if some notable deal makes a stink look for changes in 09. time will tell

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

I can not wait to see what the oems do now! I have a pretty good idea what it will do at the track and its about friggin time!!!!!!!!!! Gerhard, can we get the +45 and 50 classes limited to a 250?

Posted by: wardy---------------------

Quote:

Gerhard, can we get the +45 and 50 classes limited to a 250?

LOL

NO

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

Well, at least you thought about it! Thank you Gerhard for the fight, I still do not believe they finally did it!

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

so, with the A, B, and C designations, there's only 72 classes.

"only"

Posted by: flynbryan---------------------

So, this means that the 250 class will be a 250 class whether it is 4-stroke or 2-stroke right? And that the 450's will be open class? Thats pretty cool.

Posted by: wardy---------------------

yes bryan correct,

no pred no classes added in amatuer classes that i can see. only changed the cc limits. They did add one schoolboy class and one girls class. most all tracks ran them anyway.

we only now have 71.

HA!

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by wardy

we only now have 71.

HA!

that makes me feel all kinds of better.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bryan

So, this means that the 250 class will be a 250 class whether it is 4-stroke or 2-stroke right? And that the 450's will be open class? Thats pretty cool.

This, of course, does not affect the pro racing.

Posted by: wardy---------------------

exactly this is us amatuer mopes, and not pro.......LOL it will take a while for pro to catch on. HA!

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

So the mx/sx class and the lites still have the handicap?

Posted by: wardy---------------------

PRO Racing does NOT change, and who cares. OEM's would not allow riders to race anything but the newest coolest thing they have to see. And you can't blame them, we call it racing, they call it advertising

LOL

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

The way they eliminated 450s from arenacross led me to wonder. Restructuring the lites to a pro class and I want my pro license class seems like a good deal.

Posted by: djj---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by wardy

LOL

NO

That's ok, at least I'll have an excuse.

Posted by: lwsmithjr---------------------

Don't think anyone posted this yet. Loretta's 2008 Class Structure -
http://www.racerpress.com/newsmanag...ates/?a=109&z=4

Posted by: ricochico---------------------

that class structure for loretta lynn's is a shocker if i'm reading it correctly. i just got an rm125...

Posted by: cancanman---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricochico

that class structure for loretta lynn's is a shocker if i'm reading it correctly. i just got an rm125...

looks like the 125 is at a bigger disadvantage.

and i tried looking for the new rules on the ama site and found this http://www.amadirectlink.com/rulebooks/bulletin6_15.asp are these the new rules. and is the 125 class only for ages 12-16?

Posted by: wardy---------------------

forget that rule change thats old news and never did or will happen. the new rules will be posted any day now.

Posted by: wardy---------------------

Quote:

that class structure for loretta lynn's is a shocker if i'm reading it correctly. i just got an rm125...

how old are you?

Posted by: SpDyKen---------------------

Hey Wardy,

Hey, it's pretty cool to watch Yosemite Sam jumping, in unison, with your serial posts!

Thank you for keeping us up to date! I too was curious to hear the outcome. I appreciate your information.

Posted by: rpm12505---------------------

Wow forget taking our 144 and going to 153. It looks like we should be looking at a 250/2 stroke

If I'm reading all this right

Then again most of our organizations have dropped AMA membership requirements.

Posted by: ricochico---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by wardy

how old are you?

i'm 27. i figured a 125 would be a good bike to get now that i'm gonna start racing again(haven't raced in 4 or 5 years), and with that 153cc rule the ama passed in the summer(or so the ama website says) it seemed like a safe bet

if this is just loretta lynn's class structure, i guess it's no big deal. but if the local tracks run that structure, i'll def be looking for a 250 two stroke...

Posted by: wardy---------------------

ok, I thought if you were younger there would be schoolboy classes. MOST local tracks will run the 125 class. But i think no overboring is allowed? yea if your riding vet classes then a 250 would be better, but ya know I got my butt kicked many times by younger guys on small bikes.

Posted by: ricochico---------------------

i sure hope they run the 125 class at all amateur races. 'cause if all of them were to use loretta lynn's setup(calling 250 two strokes "Lites"??? sheesh), it would not surprise me if ktm(and maybe tm) were the only companies making 125 two strokes in a few years...

oh, and i just saw this on ama's site:

http://www.amadirectlink.com/rulebo...adUpdates07.pdf

finally!

Posted by: wardy---------------------

`yes they posted them an hour ago. all the updates are on that link.

http://www.amadirectlink.com/rulebo...adUpdates07.pdf

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

Gerhard, What happened with #40? Was it Nadine's idea?

Posted by: wardy---------------------

don't remember what 40 was?

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

Change # 40, install a railroad tie 8 feet in back of gate! The one about separating quads and bikes on the track is also long overdue!

Posted by: wardy---------------------

I personally got rid of that one.
no reason for it. using starting gate we don't need a "back" board to keep riders from backing up, a starter simply needs to do his job dropping the gate. if they roll back wait and drop the gate after a longer count. Ama should not micromanage tracks.

the quad/bike rule was also mine which I think should have passed. I haven't looked at anything except the class structure yet.

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

They both passed. I was thinking of Ryan roosting Nadine for docking him for getting a little run, he told her"Gerhard does it!" Two mistakes, he learned another valuable lesson. That outside position was a good spot!

Posted by: cujet---------------------

I think this is great. If I understand correctly (I may not), all sorts of displacement variations will be available. Smaller displacement bikes with HUGE big bore kits will be OK in certain classes such as the open class. I even read some wording on how the displacement is achieved. It can be OEM or aftermarket!

Open class 2 stroke are welcome too! I love it!

Chris

Posted by: wardy---------------------

you seem to have gotten it fine. thats why we did the changes to be more inclusive.

Posted by: Reesknight---------------------

Geez, I've been asleep for about a year and I wake up to find this?? I think its great! Happened a little earlier than I thought it would tho. This is gonna put the OEMs in a quandry and should kill both the 250f and the 125 eventually. I think the Pros will be forced into whatever is happening with amatuers before long as the manufacturers will not want to make so many different bikes. Looks like the 150 is dead in the water unless you run only Super Mini so I'm not sure if thats enough to keep it afloat. Now I'm wondering if the 500 2t will kill the 450f?

Posted by: MOTO ON RM250---------------------

125 CC (Two and Four Stroke)
250 CC (Two and Four Stroke)
Open (125cc - 700cc)

this is the way the classes are now even for local tracks?

Posted by: Chili---------------------

Any that run by AMA rules.

Posted by: MOTO ON RM250---------------------

well my local track definetly does considering they didnt let the crf150r run in the 85 class and let 144's race 125 class. im thrilled that this happened to say the least

Posted by: allmoto616---------------------

[QUOTE=Reesknight]This is gonna put the OEMs in a quandry and should kill both the 250f and the 125 eventually. QUOTE]

Shouldn't this popularize the 125...

not kill it?

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2007 AMA Congress

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