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Getting Back Into It, Need Some Advice
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Posted by: crwiseman---------------------

Hello all, after I moved at this time last year I sold my 1980 Maico 504 that I have owned 20+ years. I just didn't have the room for and have not ridden it for 15+ years.

So here is the point, recently a good friend and relative of mine bought a 2008 CRF450 Honda and wants me to go riding with him and his 11 year old son. I am teaching the kid how to ride off road on my 1971 Mini Trail 50 (auto) but all I had left to ride was my totally restored 1971 Hodaka Ace 100B. Not the best thing to flog at a muddy SVRA!

So I am looking to get another dirt bike that I would store in my relatives's enclosed trailer. I have not really followed all the news and latest-greatest in the four stroke revolution of late so I don't know what to get. I am a little uncomfortable riding his 450 as it is just too powerfull, anything past 1/4 gas just slides it out plus it doesn't make any noise . . . what is a motorcycle without a memorable exhaust noise? (I own a Kawi 750 2-stroke triple too). It is also a little tall when you get to the walking in the muck speeds/situations. I used to have a new Honda 1983 CR480 but sold it as I was never at ease on it.

I don't want to spend a lot of dough in case he gets bored with the sport so here are some local used bikes that have caught my fancy: 1) 2005 CRF250 asking 3.5k, 2) 1997 CR500 asking 2.5k. I am primarily a "fast" trail rider and I never crash (knock knock). I am also a "finick" who washes and cleans a bike after riding so I don't like a bike that looks like it has go farther on its side than on its tires. I don't really need CR500 power but I hate having to downshift to second or first to go over a monster hill. The electric starting on the 450F was way cool but I also realize it was something else to go wrong , heavy and might be problematic to keep maintained, etc. I do recently recall (2-5 years ago) that Yamaha made a nice 400 4-stroke enduro that seemed a nice compromise from the 2-stroke world.

I also ride a lot of little kids on the tank and bigger ones on the back. My old Maico had buddy pegs added to it. Any and all general observations would be appreciated.

Posted by: BadgerMan---------------------

Some good reliable used bike options of which you will find many to pick from:

Yamaha WR400/426/450F
KTM 400/450EXC
Honda CRF450X

If you want a 2 stroke, find a later model YZ250 or a KTM 250EXC, XCW, or XC.

The Yamaha four stroke would be my first choice for tooling around with the kids. The KTM runs a bit hot for such duty.

Posted by: jcarautos1---------------------

Yz250 is perfect for me and has the power i need to take the step ups and still ride slow or fast on trail.
Good Luck

Posted by: BigRedAF---------------------

If the CRF450 is to fast then stay away from the CR500...

Any YZ250 from 2000 and up is a good bike. The RM250 from 2004 and up is a good bike. The CR250's after 2002 weren't known for large power. I've never liked KX's but they work for some guys around here.

All the 4 banger 250 MX bikes work good but they're a bit under powered for a guy that likes big bikes.

Personally I would stay away from the YZ426, you need a check list to start that beast. All the newer 450's have an auto decompression system so just kick away and it starts.

Posted by: O3RM125---------------------

Coming back last month after 16+ years off left me with alot of questions too.. The 4-stroke craze was the oddest thing I guess.. I remember reading about the testing Yamaha was doing, and seeing the pics of the bike in magazines back in the day, but never thought 4 strokes would become what they are today in mx/sx.

I steered away from 4 strokes mainly because I knew 2 stroke engines and how to work on them, add in the stories of how the 4t bikes can be unreliable(earlier models I think mostly), and/or when they break it can be big $$ to repair.

I learned that the newer 2t bikes have cyl. heads that cant be bored over stock specs and I suppose this offsets some of the overall cheap-ness of 2t engine work. From what Ive gathered though repairing a 4t bike is still quite a bit more costly then 2t, and the overall maintenance is/can be more costly as well.

It will feel odd for sure to be one of the few 2t bikes at the track, or out riding somewhere.. but to me it was the most comfortable choice after never riding a 4t bike(aside from 1980's xr50 and 100's and such), or a bike over 125cc, I was just unsure about that 250cc wether it be 2t or 4t.. I am only 5' 10" and 160lbs. though and will be riding aggresively to get my form back from 16+ years ago(I hope!! lol).

I can only imagine the "tractability" etc. of the 4t engine, and Im sure it has advantages over 2t in many conditions, but I went with what I knew and that was 2 strokes

Posted by: crwiseman---------------------

So . . . how much faster is a CR500 s-stroke than a CRF450 4-stroke? Hella faster or marginally? I don't really like big bikes but rather middle-sized bike that are fast too, hence my old Maico.

How much of a power difference is there between to CRF250 and the CRF450? The reason I felt the CRF450 was too fast was because I was just minutes ago riding a Hodaka 100, a Schwinn would seem fast in comparison too.

Posted by: wake_rider---------------------

I ride a 99 yz250, and I love that bike. I grew up racing mx and now I mosty ride trails, grass tracks, and a little mx and that bike suits me really well. It has plenty of punch to push me over any triple and up any step up, and it is very controlled in the trails with the right clutch/throttle control. Out of the Japanese bikes the later model yamaha's are the best all around bikes because they are the only company still putting research and developement into their 2 stroke programs. Other than that, KTM builds great smokers, but they can be a little more pricey and more difficult to get parts for. The great thing about my yz is that I can get all kinds of aftermarket parts or oem parts at the drop of a hat at a very inexpensive price.

About the power, I know you rode a big cc smoker before, but that bike was built in the days before power valves, better heads, and piston upgrades. You would be suprised with what a 2 stroke 250 puts out now and it would probably outrun your old Maico, and it has the benifit of much better suspension and it's MUCH lighter.

Posted by: wake_rider---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by crwiseman

So . . . how much faster is a CR500 s-stroke than a CRF450 4-stroke? Hella faster or marginally? I don't really like big bikes but rather middle-sized bike that are fast too, hence my old Maico.

How much of a power difference is there between to CRF250 and the CRF450? The reason I felt the CRF450 was too fast was because I was just minutes ago riding a Hodaka 100, a Schwinn would seem fast in comparison too.

There is quite a bit of difference between a cr500 and a crf450. The smoker is a heck of a lot to handle in woods or on a mx track, but it's great if you plan on riding open fields, deserts, or sand dunes. Not so great if you want to ride anything else. The engine isn't refined enough to be a smoother powerband, they're kindof all or nothing with a real sharp increase in power as soon as they hit the pipe.

If I were you I'd stay away from the CRF line. They are great for people that want to race because they are plenty powerful for their class and they come pretty race ready from the manufacturer. That being said, they are pretty volatile. When they break, they seem to break big and a little more often than the rest of the class. Kawi's are bulding really good 4 strokes as well as Yamaha's. It seems to me that you are really searching for more of a play bike and less of a racer, so I would recommend going with a early 2000's wr400 or something similar if you are wanting to go with a 4 stroke, but again I think I would go with a 250 smoker just for the fact you can find them very inexpensive and they are incredibly easy to work on....

Posted by: crwiseman---------------------

Am I wrong in assuming that it is somewhat difficult to find a 250 2-stroke that doesn't have to be revved up high to make serious power? Or is that just more of a 125 2-stroke thing?

When I pull the trigger and I am in the wrong gear (too high), I need it to go.

Posted by: wake_rider---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by crwiseman

Am I wrong in assuming that it is somewhat difficult to find a 250 2-stroke that doesn't have to be revved up high to make serious power? Or is that just more of a 125 2-stroke thing?

When I pull the trigger and I am in the wrong gear (too high), I need it to go.

The smaller smokers (125's and lower) are very much that way, but you will have no issues with a 250 not having enough low end unless:

1) you need to rebuild the topend (about every 50 hours of riding. It takes about 2.5 hours and $200 for the new piston, rings, gasket kit, wrist pin, and wrist pin bearing)

2) or you are in wayyy too low of a gear, to the point of the bike stalling.

So if you are in 3rd gear when you should be in 1st, then yeah, you'll have issues. You'd have issues with a 4 stroke in that same situation. After riding once you should have no issues with knowing what's the right gear to be in, and the 250 smoker is much more forgiving because it does have a good amount of low end with quite a bit of top end

....

Lets put it this way, my bike has enough pull to be going 45 mph or so down a dirt track in 4th gear and with no clutch, and just a small amount of preloading the front end, I can pull my pull wheelies without any problems.

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Getting Back Into It, Need Some Advice

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