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Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

<script type="text/javascript" src="http://interactive.foxbusiness.com/projects/debt-clock/include.js"></script>

Posted by: dirt bike dave---------------------

FWIW, that figure does not include 'unfunded obligations' that we have already committed to, such as Social Security.

The unfunded obligations are another $192,000 per citizen, raising the total per citizen to $230,000+-.

Keep in mind many citizens will never work, many are retired and not working any more, and many baby boomers are nearing the end of their productive life.

So if you are young and just entering the work force, your 'share' is far far more than $230,000. And that does not include future deficits.

Good luck, America, we are going to need it.

Posted by: BadgerMan---------------------

Wow, feel that nice breeze!

Posted by: dirt bike dave---------------------

Check out www.usdebtclock.org for the debt per person plus other big picture items.

It's pretty depressing.

I think there are some ways we can eventually get the debt under control.

Unfortunately the cures are probably worse than the disease.

Firstly, we can reduce the debt per person by 5%+- by giving amnesty to illegal aliens. It'll happen within 5 years.

Income tax increases are the first play in the play book, but are reaching the point of diminishing returns (until the massive inflation hits, and everyone gets pushed into higher tax brackets).

There will be more hidden taxes on everything under the sun. Some are going to be big, like on your utility bill.

Also, look for a massive increase in inheritance/death taxes. I hope you and your kids were not planning on having an inheritance, lol.

But the big pot of gold for the government is selling carbon credits for public lands. Basically, the Chinese will 'buy' carbon credits from us, if we use the sale proceeds to pay down the debt. This will greatly reduce our future industrial capacity, much to the pleasure of our creditors/competitors (also the Chinese).

No global warming = no carbon credits to sell (and no commissions for Al Gore on each sale). No carbon credits to sell = No way to pay off the debt.

Posted by: _JOE_---------------------

Honestly, I think they should tax things like alcohol and tabacco more. I'm not opposed to legalizing marijuana and selling/taxing it like alcohol. Use the proceeds to help knock the debt down. That way you're not forcing everyone to pay, just those who choose to. I wonder how much revenue the gov't makes form alcohol?

Posted by: jsantapau---------------------

national sales tax?

Posted by: _JOE_---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsantapau

national sales tax?

Ehh, that kinda forces people to pay. Might as well raise the income tax.

Posted by: Patman---------------------

Chack out the latest Forbes magazine, right on the cover is the pot discussion. BIG numbers!

Posted by: BSWIFT---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patman

Chack out the latest Forbes magazine, right on the cover is the pot discussion. BIG numbers!

The Mexican drug cartels are already proof of the numbers.

Posted by: _JOE_---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patman

Chack out the latest Forbes magazine, right on the cover is the pot discussion. BIG numbers!

Right, think of the possible revenue if we could market it.

Posted by: Rich Rohrich---------------------

... and here I thought the political forum had been mothballed. Dopey me.

Posted by: jsantapau---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by _JOE_

Ehh, that kinda forces people to pay. Might as well raise the income tax.

check out fairtax http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer instead of an income tax on what people earn the idea is to have a federal income tax on what people buy. just about gets rid of the IRS(instead of them tracking manufactures,shippers,retailers,lending institutions individual wage earners etc they only have to keep the paperwork straight on what retailers sell) would tax anybody in the US that buys anything whether they are here earning money legally or not..... promotes instead of punishing people that save or invest..... self adjusting .... if you can afford to buy a cadillac you can afford to pay the taxes compared to someone who would buy a chevy........ the street corner dealer would be paying more in taxes driving in his Hummer with 22" wheels than I would driving my Escort and saving or investing

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Rohrich

... and here I thought the political forum had been mothballed. Dopey me.

Quote:

Bad experience with something? Feel like you've been wronged? Speak your mind here. Enter at your own risk, it gets hot in here, if you get burned, don't complain!

Posted by: Rich Rohrich---------------------

Your house, your call.

Posted by: Patman---------------------

I think the Fair Tax is a great idea. I suspect all the bottom feeders in DC would disagree because it's a simpler system and thus more difficult to manipulate. The folks at the IRD are very powerful and I can't imagine any of them being willing to give up their job and associated government benifits for the good of the country.

Posted by: jsantapau---------------------

hmmm what do you think of a million dollar march on Washington D.C. ..... try to get a million people to march on D.C take out a 1 dollar bill and just burn it,

what I think would be real sweet is if 4 million people did it, 1 million in front of the IRS building,federal reserve building, the white house and the capitol maybe a few local chapters in front of the individual mints,

disclaimer burning money is defacing public property and is illegal but hey they will just print more right

Posted by: Rich Rohrich---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsantapau

hmmm what do you think of a million dollar march on Washington D.C. ..... try to get a million people to march on D.C take out a 1 dollar bill and just burn it,

KIDS, the above statement should make it clear why you should ALWAYS wear your helmet.

Posted by: Ol'89r---------------------

The sad part of this whole mess is many people don't seem to realize that the more money the government prints, the less the dollars in our own wallets are worth. They think it doesn't affect them since they don't see a direct connection to their own wealth.

This is a direct attack on the wealth of the American people. The value of the dollar has dropped significantly since nixon took us off of the gold standard. The same thing happened in Venezuela and the people there watched as their money became virtually worthless.

Wake up America! Stop the insanity. Vote 'em ALL out in 2010.

Posted by: Senior KX Rider---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ol'89r

The sad part of this whole mess is many people don't seem to realize that the more money the government prints, the less the dollars in our own wallets are worth. They think it doesn't affect them since they don't see a direct connection to their own wealth.

This is a direct attack on the wealth of the American people. The value of the dollar has dropped significantly since nixon took us off of the gold standard. The same thing happened in Venezuela and the people there watched as their money became virtually worthless.

Wake up America! Stop the insanity. Vote 'em ALL out in 2010.

Very well said

Posted by: IndyMX---------------------

But it's hard for the greedy liberals to vote out their cash cows..

Posted by: Jaybird---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ol'89r

The sad part of this whole mess is many people don't seem to realize that the more money the government prints, the less the dollars in our own wallets are worth. They think it doesn't affect them since they don't see a direct connection to their own wealth.

This is a direct attack on the wealth of the American people. The value of the dollar has dropped significantly since nixon took us off of the gold standard. The same thing happened in Venezuela and the people there watched as their money became virtually worthless.

Wake up America! Stop the insanity. Vote 'em ALL out in 2010.

Hear hear!

Posted by: jsantapau---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Rohrich

KIDS, the above statement should make it clear why you should ALWAYS wear your helmet.

truer words have never been spoken

but hey if a few million people gave up one candy bar for one day ....not too drastic on an individual basis,not as drastic as seceding from the union or the original tea parties and 4 million ain't squat to the 20 billion they print but it just might raise a few more eyebrows than yours

Posted by: IndyMX---------------------

If a million people with a single purpose showed up in Washington one day, we could over turn this mistake without issue.

But.. Too many people are all talk, no action.

Posted by: ChopperDave---------------------

I think Americas Debt Clock is stuck on WFO! Can you say November 2010? I hope you can.

Posted by: BSWIFT---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by IndyMX

If a million people with a single purpose showed up in Washington one day, we could over turn this mistake without issue.

But.. Too many people are all talk, no action.

We'd be labled radicals, racists, etc. My prayer is that this current obamacare and cap & tax bill will be defeated or delayed until mid-year 2010. I really don't think it would pass after about May with elections in November.
I wish that I had had the money to join the 9/12 project in Washington but I just could afford it. Likely consequence is that I'll never be able to afford it if these crappy power grabs pass.

Posted by: IndyMX---------------------

I believe I read last week that Cap & Trade was dead.. I could be mistaken.

Posted by: 2-Strokes 4-ever---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by IndyMX

If a million people with a single purpose showed up in Washington one day, we could over turn this mistake without issue.

But.. Too many people are all talk, no action.

Bingo!
Attend a Tea Party, be a mobster. At the very least, it's encouraging to see there are like minds out there.

Posted by: whenfoxforks-ruled---------------------

Everyone has 1 friend who chain letters all the bs about economics floating around the internet? All our issues are from the current Pres, and his race? What a bunch of crap. There are some 500 or so BOZO'S that control our laws, of them, they have a butt wad of constituents with BIG money that sway their decisions, not us, we mean squat. It sure seems, when a guy reaches DC, he falls in line with the rest, or gets ran out of town. There is no particular party at fault, that is their mis-information. Like asking little Johnny who started the fight, point at someone else, and it ends up in a circle! Its a circle in DC alright, a circle jerk. And we the people will never band together to stop this, till its too late. Remove the governments health care program, make them work for 30 years to obtain SSI, like most the rest of us. Drop their pay to a 5 digit a year income. Pay them for what they actually do. Remove 1 vulture, there are 1000's ready to step in. There are a lot of used car salesman out of work! A small team could/should have taken care of the douche bag that runs Muslim radicals. We are in another loose-loose situation in the Iraq and Afganny. We are not the worlds Shepard, or even close. This so far is nothing, compared to the next 2 years. I do not have the answers, or the book, as does anyone else. The problem starts when someone thinks they do. The entire planet needs to work together, or disappear. The only way that will happen is for the powers to be to admit guilt, and work toward 1 common goal. Sadly this will never happen. How about a 1st dirt world meeting, go for a long ride, and hash the issues over a really big fire afterward? Close the borders, burn the money and DC, that will be plan B. Or plan C, wait for a worldwide catastrophic event, to awake who ever is left, that we all are only 1 group of people.

Posted by: IndyMX---------------------

I agree Bob, the problem isn't Obama.. It's the whole freakin lot of em.

I am all for a complete reboot of the system. Send all of em home, and start over.

Repeal 99% of the crap that has been written into law over the last 200 years and start over.

We all know what part of it doesn't work, so get rid of it and start over.

I'm thinking perhaps let the Fed handle the military, and just about nothing else and let the individual states take care of the rest..

Don't like the speed limits in your state, move. Make it competitive. If a state wants to keep enough citizens to pay taxes and run their state, they better make it attractive to the people.

With enough people behind the idea, it can happen.

Again, people are just too damned lazy to do what needs to be done.

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