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yz250(f) or 450f
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Posted by: Jarpil---------------------

Hello everyone.
I'm new member and also a newbie to dirt biking.
My friends got me into this fun so I'm looking for a dirt bike.
I'd like to get Yamaha but I'm not sure which one.
I checked Yamaha's web site and now I can't decide between 250 or 450. I'm 6' 170lbs and like I said a newbie.The only experience with dirt bikes I have is riding my friend's yz450f in front of his house. I don't see myself like an aggressive rider. I'd like to try some jumping I guess but nothing extreme.
Now should I get 450f or 250f or just 250?
Thanks everyone for any help.
Btw I'm 34 years old. This is gonna be just a recreational activity for me. I'd be riding mostly woods I guess but would like to try tracks as well.
Is there a huge difference between let's say 2003 models and 2006 models.I mean a difference which I as a rookie would notice.

Posted by: jb_dallas---------------------

The first thing you want to do is determine which you are going to ride...trails or the track. No one bike does both really well. You need to familiarize yourself with the different models and their purpose. At your weight and inexperience, I would probably recommend a 250cc...WR250 for the trails or YZ250F for the track. I am a year older than you, the same height, and about +15 pounds. I have been riding since I was 9 (with a few years off in between) and I ride a YZ400F on the trail. I would not recommend my bike to a newbie. My friends are my age and they are beginners. They have their hands full with my XR400, which is about 12 horsepower less than my Yamaha. I always err on the side of caution when giving advise.

Posted by: Jarpil---------------------

Why wouldn't be YZ models good for trails?

Posted by: _JOE_---------------------

A YZ would be fine. It has stiffer suspension and more nasty power making it ride a bit harsher and be a bit harder to control in the woods. A beginner will likely find a 250 2 stroke to be too much bike. A 125 2 stroke or 250f will be better beginner bikes. Your budget will dictate which bike you choose. The new 4 strokes are pricey to buy, maintain and repair. If you have a big budget for a dirt bike go get a new YZ250f and you'll be happy for at least a few years.

Posted by: nikki---------------------

A 450F would be way too much for a beginner in the woods. I personally agree with Joe that a 125 or 250F would be better beginner bikes, and both would do fine in both track and trails. A 125 will cost less to repair if you have any major failures, but I personally love the power of the 250F's, much more linear and always there, compared to a 125 that is more on/off. A 250 two-stroke would probably work too, but might be a little much for a beginner. If possible, you should try to find some people in your area with different bikes and give them a test ride.

Posted by: jb_dallas---------------------

I ride a YZ400F in the woods, so I have first hand experience on this topic.

1) The YZ is not geared for woods riding, it is geared for an MX track. In order to have a manageable (slow enough) first gear, I am running 13/51 sprockets...it came with 14/49, so you can imagine the impact to my top end speed...it tops out about 50 mph. It will get there very quickly, but there are a few fire roads where I want to run faster and cant. The WR (Wide Range) transmission needs no special gearing and will run faster than you need to go on dirt.

2) The YZ has a small gas tank. This may not seem like a big deal, but if you are trail riding, your range is very limited. I bought mine used with an aftermarket oversized tank (about $250-$300), so I lucked out.

3) The YZ has smaller, lighter radiators than the WR. While zipping around an MX track, thats no big deal because the bike gets plenty of air flow. However, running slowly through woods will sometimes cause the bike to overheat. I have tried to combat this problem by running water wetter and buying a Trail Tech Computer that gives engine temp.

These are the reasons I recommended the WR250. I love the YZ's power, but given the chance to do it all over, I would buy a WR

I disagree that a 125 MX bike is a good solution. I owned a RM125 a few months ago and sold it for this exact reason...they suck on the trail. Again, it is a motocross bike designed for a track. They absolutely no bottom end power and that makes trail riding very difficult.

Posted by: robwbright---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by jb_dallas

I disagree that a 125 MX bike is a good solution. I owned a RM125 a few months ago and sold it for this exact reason...they suck on the trail. Again, it is a motocross bike designed for a track. They absolutely no bottom end power and that makes trail riding very difficult.

Bah, humbug.

If you learn to ride a 125 in the woods, you'll be able to ride anything, anywhere. I used to ride trails all over the place on my RM125. Sold it to my bro and he's far faster on the trails on the 125 than I am on my 250f.

But yes, they have no bottom end and it is more challenging.

Posted by: jb_dallas---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by robwbright

Bah, humbug.

If you learn to ride a 125 in the woods, you'll be able to ride anything, anywhere.

But yes, they have no bottom end and it is more challenging.

I dont disagree, but what 34 year old wants to start on a 125? Buy a bike with some low end..its so much easier to learn.

Posted by: Jarpil---------------------

Thanks to all of you guys. I learned a lot. I don't have a big budget at all. Actually I want to spend as less as possible. I found few nice yz250f's on craigslist. I want to spend no more then 2000 on the bike + 200-300 on apparel. Found only 1 wr250 2002 for 1800. The yz's are about 2000-2500 for 2007.
Now after reading jb_dallas' post I really don't know if I want to buy yz250f and a nice wr would be a lot over my budget.
Anyway I'll think this over.

Posted by: _JOE_---------------------

Cheap 250fs can be a disaster.......

Posted by: jb_dallas---------------------

I agree with Joe. That is why you want to learn what to look for when buying a used bike..that is very important. I have learned the hard way. Do some searches on this site...I know I have made a list on here at least 4 times.

Posted by: Jarpil---------------------

What should I paid attention to when buying used bike?

EDIT: looking for the list

Posted by: Jarpil---------------------

When buying a dirt bike is there any documentation I should be getting from the seller? Title etc.
Then do I have to register the bike in local DMV office?

Posted by: longtime coming---------------------

Don't buy an old 250f! Try to find a nice KDX 200 or 220 (2 stroke trail bike)or an XR 400 (4 stroke trail bike) to start with. You will be much happier I'm sure. Once you learn a bit, then buy something else (or not). Try to find a low-hour, well maintained machine (easier said than done). The amount of money you can spend is not enough to buy a good 250f, and a 450f is way too much bike for most. Personally, I would not buy a used 250f unless I knew the bike well.

Posted by: jb_dallas---------------------

The obvious points that you would check are
1) Engine oil leaks and noise, also check for smoke if its a 4 stroke. A healthy 4 stroke may show very little smoke on startup, but not after it is warmed up. The pipe should not be hot...this is a sign they started it before you showed up.
2) Check out the air filter and take a look at the oil. Does it appear that the bike has been maintained? Of course, keep in mind they could have "prepared" the bike to sell.
3) If the seller is claiming low hours, look for small signs of wear such as rotor wear, peg wear, sprocket wear, engine cover and frame rub marks. A bike with alot of hours will have rub marks where the boots contacted the bike.
4) Check for slack or movement in the wheels, this is also a sign of wear. If the wheels have side to side movement, it will need bearings. If ridden long enough with bad bearings, the hub will wear out. Hubs arent cheap.
5) Check for fork dampening and oil leaks. Fork seal replacement will cost you about $150-$200 at a shop.
6) Ask alot of questions about the bikes history, maintenance, etc. Listen closely to their responses...do they sound truthful?

Posted by: Jarpil---------------------

I found 2007 yz250f for 2000. Isn't it way too cheap?
Here is a picture. What do you guys think?

Posted by: _JOE_---------------------

Yup, looks like an 07 yzf. Unfortunately that's about all we can tell you. It COULD be a great deal, then again it could be a disaster and need 2k worth of work......

Posted by: smahala1286---------------------

Looks to be in decent shape, it should be its a 07. It has numbers so it might have been a race bike (ie ridden hard). There is probably a reason it is for sale for so cheap. It would be worth it to go look at and take for a quick ride. It will give you an idea of 250f power output

Posted by: Jarpil---------------------

The seller says it has not been raced. Trail riding only, that's what he says. The thing is the bike is in Alabama, 3 hours drive so it's not around the corner.
I think that all the side fairings have been replaced or atleast it looks like that(no graphics on them at all). The reason for it might be the bike has been dropped a lot therefore he put new fairings on. I don't know, it's hard to say. I'm just speculating.

Posted by: _JOE_---------------------

The bike was dropped on the side at some point, the shroud is whitened around the radiator. The graphics probly got all scuffed up and looked like crap so they peeled them off. The bike looks ridden and could have 200 hours on it, you'll never know for sure until you get it home and crack it open to inspect it all. Or you can ride it as is and maybe get lucky? It's a gamble, are you lucky?

Posted by: jb_dallas---------------------

Like I said before, if you are riding trails, go with a WR. A 3 hour drive to ride a MX bike? I would pass. I would educate myself about bikes if I were you....you have no idea what you are buying and no idea what to look for when you get there. Buy an XR400, they are reliable and low maintenance.

Posted by: Jarpil---------------------

Thanks to all of you for your help.
I'm educating myself about dirt bikes everyday.Compared to what I knew a week ago today I'm walking dirt bikes encyklopedia

Anyway I was trying to find xr400 and couldn't. None. They don't make them anymore do they?
How about 2 stroke? Would it be too much of power for me to handle or would it be the same as 4 stroke?
2 strokes maintenance cost isn't as high as 4 stroke, correct?
Just for the information, would you guys explain the difference between 2 and 4 stroke? Does it behave differently in certain situations on the track? All I have heard it's more powerful then 4 stroke.

Posted by: smahala1286---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jarpil

I'm walking dirt bikes encyklopedia

Just for the information, would you guys explain the difference between 2 and 4 stroke? Does it behave differently in certain situations on the track? All I have heard it's more powerful then 4 stroke.

If you dont know the difference between a 2-stroke and a 4-stroke then you need to expand your encyclopedia. Haha

Yes two strokes are a lot cheaper for maintenance. 4 strokes have a wider power band and better tractability. They do behave differently from each other, with a 2 stroke you will most likely be using the clutch a lot more. 4 strokes you can be a little more relaxed and lug gears. And yes cc's for cc's a 2 stroke is more powerful, lighter and easier maintenance. I'm a fan of 2 strokes if you couldn't tell. I don't know that much about 4 strokes but hopefully I was some help.

Posted by: _JOE_---------------------

Quote:

Originally Posted by smahala1286

NOT TRUE!!!!!(at least not clear enough) He's just been recommended an XR400. It's a 4 stroke trail bike with a ton of useable power. It's a far longer living engine than a 2 stroke MX bike. People get hundreds of hours with no repairs on XRs. They are heavier than an MX 2 stroke and make a bit less peak HP but they have much broader power and a much nicer ride in the trails. It's the new generation of high RPM 4 strokes that cost more to maintain. It's more of a trail bike vs race bike thing anymore, not 2 vs 4 stroke.

Posted by: jb_dallas---------------------

Well said Joe. I dont think very many 2 strokes would outlast an XR.

Jarpil

Honda stopped making XR400s in 2004. Apparently, Honda wasnt making enough money on the low maintenance XR, so they started manufacturing bikes you have to rebuild every 50 hours. (personal opinion) I own a 2001 and you cant beat the low end power and reliability.

Personally, I am beginning to lean towards KTM. I may start shopping for a 04-07 450 EXC this Spring.

Posted by: smahala1286---------------------

yeah i guess I should have said modern 4 strokes like the yz250f and yz450f he was talking about in the original post.

Posted by: Jarpil---------------------

What do you guys think about 2006 KTM 250 SXF? Is it as needy bike as Yamaha YZ250f?

Posted by: _JOE_---------------------

Yes it is....

Posted by: jb_dallas---------------------

I just read that particular model is a motocross bike. If you are riding trails, you want the EXC. I know a few guys with KTMs (450 and 530 EXC models) that rave about them. A guy at work has a 530 EXC with over 120 hours and it has only had the valves shimmed. He had a 525 KTM before that that ran 250 hours before a rebuild. That same guy's son rides a KTM 250 SX (2 stroke) with over 100 hours and the original top end. I am starting to believe that KTM is the way to go

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yz250(f) or 450f

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