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That's it. Brown is officially off my "A" list...
(Click here to view the original thread with full colors/images)

Posted by: yarbonwick---------------------

...and onto my a- hole list. I defended him before but that move on Fonseca was down right dirty. <- Red Bud

Posted by: MoO_coW---------------------

Ya, He rammed him plain and simple.

Posted by: nephron---------------------

I loved it. Heheheh...

Posted by: IDkTm---------------------

It was pretty blatant, but Brown just flat out rides with lots of intensity. Not that I'm defending him it was dirty and would have really ticked me off if it had been me on the recieving end. Not a bad job of Fonzie at keeping the thumper running, theres no telling how many laps it would have taken him to get it going.

Posted by: super rat---------------------

What was Fonzie thinking? Brown ran into him twice right before that and he still left the door wide open. I like Brown and I think he is the fastest 125 rider right now. Travis did the same thing to Ward in the first moto.

Posted by: CRGuy---------------------

Fonzie was going so wide all the way around red Bud. He could have stayed up there if he didn't have to do wide and almost fall off that one berm. He was so close to going over!
CRG

Posted by: KXTodd---------------------

When Langston took out Bonds I was like man I can't believe it, But the way Brown took him out was different I think. It was like a game of chicken who was going to let off first, he knew he was coming on that line.

Posted by: nephron---------------------

I'd like to see Brown try to do that to Langston, or Langston try to do that to Brown....

They're both smooth, very fast, relentless, aggressive and a little on the nasty side.

However, it's less likely to happen because neither of them is likely to set themselves up outside. :silly:

As far as Brown being the fastest out there, I see what you're saying. However, Langston is fast becoming my hero for obvious reasons, and if he can ride that fast now with a separated shoulder, he's gonna kick some serious ass toward the end of the season. I don't see Pastrana being any faster than either of them. He needs to step up to the 250's & let these two dog it out.

Posted by: JuliusPleaser---------------------

That was kinda rude, but I enjoyed it.

I'm not a Fonz fan. He really pissed me off when he mugged Kelly Smith.

Do ya think anyone will retaliate against Brown?

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

So far, every race I've seen Brown in, he's taken someone out. The man will be wearing a target on his back soon enough.

I wish these 10-year pros who point out COULD'NT sit out / go to Europe for 2 years then come back, the 125's are for the young guys. Too bad if you don't catch a 250 ride in time. It's cherry picking as far as I'm concerned. I'd love to see Brown pull that crap in the 250's.

Posted by: MXbabe---------------------

Cherry picking? Have you looked at the 125 gate? That class is stacked, I think the 125 class is deeper in talent than the 250's this year. You can not "point out" of the 125 nationals. It's not a suport class like in SX. I think it's great that Brown has come back home and shown such speed, he surprised me. Poor Fonzie, he had a choice too he could have used his breaks and not have gotten parked. He saw Brown coming and did nothing too avoid the stuff.

Posted by: super rat---------------------

dam it, the rat not the babe. :o

Posted by: Vic---------------------

Wuhrd uhp to MXbabe.

Posted by: jsned---------------------

Super rat:
I was standing by that hairpin,cliff,section at RedBud when Ward went down
Travis didnt touch him. Ward went wide and got caught in the loose stuff, tucked the front and ate dirt. All day long riders had taken the inside and passed with ease, Ward should have seen that.

Posted by: IDkTm---------------------

Brown and Fonzie got together again today in the first moto at Unadilla. The results of this tangle looks like Fonseca got forced off the track by Brown. We'll have to wait for the ESPN 2 coverage to see what happened for sure I guess. These two look like they got a little rivalry brewing.

Posted by: xrsforever---------------------

I thought Browns move was dirty too.

Posted by: Natester---------------------

Even more ironic since Brownie was squealing so loud when Pastrana moved over at 'Wick. What an idiot.

Posted by: CRGuy---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by super rat
dam it, the rat not the babe. :o

Ummm..... :think

Posted by: WaltCMoto---------------------

Brown is fast enough that he doesnt need to pull B.S. like that t-bone. That wasnt an aggressive move, it was a slam.

Posted by: SATxMotoX---------------------

I can't believe the AMA didn't say anything about that T bone Brown put on Fonzie. IMO, it's fine to be agressive, it's fine to take lines from other riders and make them earn their spot on the track, but you have to do it in CONTROL.

From what I saw, Brown came into that corner hot and used Fonzie's 250f as his berm. Fonzie, regardless of whether or not he picked a bad line, never had a chance. If you watch the tape you'll see him flinch and try to move left right before he gets rammed but he never had a chance.

It was dirty, plain and simple.

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

Brown was way faster than Nerdly-oops-Fonzie. Fonzerelli deserved to get punted. Brown is the prototypical 125 rider IMO. He is wide open all the time and you KNOW when he is faster and behind you. He has the rep for staying in his line and if you are there-well two objects can't occupy the space theory folks-someone gonna get moved. I like his style and he should have gotten the 125 ride for the MXDes Nation.

Posted by: Natester---------------------

Thanks for enlightening us all with your intelligent comments. Brown will get his.:scream:

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

At least I try to give reasons for my comments.:think

Posted by: SATxMotoX---------------------

Quote:

Brown was way faster

He was BEHIND Fonseca when he dropped him. He may have been putting in faster lap times than Fonzie, but he took him out in that corner, plain and simple. That move give new defintion to a "block pass".

I still think it was a dirty-style takedown. I'm well aware that there's plenty of bumping and bar-banging that goes on, plus "rubbin is racing", right? But this isn't demolition motorcross for crying-out-loud.

My $.02.

Chris

Posted by: JimmyD2---------------------

Yeah, I've been rooting for Brown all year long. Sorta came out of nowhere. But the Red Bud slam was a bit too much. Then I just watched highlights of Unadilla on Motoworld and saw Brown run Fonseca completely off the track. Maybe he just doesn't like the Fonz... or maybe he is just too aggressive. I'm starting to get the feeling he would take out anyone in his way.

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

Well of course Fonzie was in front of Brown, that's is why Brown had to get by. Had Fonzie had the brains to stay behind Brown, he would not have fallen. The 125 class is like a demo derby. The bikes are not like 250's, they have to pass when they feel they can as they don't have the power to just fly by on sheer HP. You have to bump more in this class and ride more agressively. That is all Brown does.

Posted by: IDkTm---------------------

I agree with you moto1313, Brown should have gotten our 125 MX des Nations spot. He has raced in Europe so he'll have much better knowledge of the track than TP. That is if TP's brain isn't fully scrambled and cooked by then.

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

Quote:

Bob Hannah said:"What do I think about other racers? On the track, I hate 'em. Off the track, I just plain don't like 'em. You can't be friends with a guy you might have to knock off the track to pass. And if I'm behind, I'm gonna pass"

I realize Mike Brown is no Bob Hannah, but doesn't it seem that our racers are getting too "nicey-nice?"

I remember the Hannah-Howerton battles in the days of yore. You usually hated one of 'em and loved the other, and it gave everyone something to talk about. Nowadays, there is very little rubbing going on, and nobody gets "parked" hardly at all any more.

Why don't we just give 'em all skirts and wigs. And don't forget the post-race tea parties.

Just my 2 cents.

Posted by: WoodsRider---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by XRpredator
Why don't we just give 'em all skirts and wigs. And don't forget the post-race tea parties.

Then it would be just like NASCAR.

Seriously though, Brown is an aggressive rider. He's paid to go out and race and that's exactly what he's doing. Personally that's the kind of racing I enjoy watching. Sure the jumping part is cool and watching the way your favorite rider cuts a smooth turn is pretty neat, but there better be some good bar-banging action going on too. Besides, who wants to be roosted by a four-stroke for 30 minutes? Not me! :scream:

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

I agree with you moto1313, Brown should have gotten our 125 MX des Nations spot

No, that spot should go to the best 125 rider we have, which, it did. NOT to a career 125'er.

On the other hand...

Just think how many of those furiners that hillbilly could take out!! Maybe even end some off their careers! With all the talk of the rest of the world bailing on the GP's and coming to the States next year... this could be a good thing!

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by Okiewan
the rest of the world bailing on the GP's and coming to the States next year... this could be a good thing!

Actually, I agree that the rest of the world coming here to compete is a good thing, but that's a topic for another thread (and probably an interesting one at that!)

I also agree that in the long run, Travis is the man in the 125 class. But, if he can't compete due to health problems (which could be very likely), Brownie would be a good choice as replacement.

I just wish someone would beat the Leprechaun!

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Did you watch Red Bud? In my book Tortelli and Windham both beat him. Too bad their bikes returned the favor.

Posted by: Max Factor---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by moto1313
Had Fonzie had the brains to stay behind Brown, he would not have fallen. The 125 class is like a demo derby.

What an inciteful observation :scream: You're joking of course.
I just watched the incident for the first time. Forget who the riders were, what bike they ride, what sort of style they use, everything. That was a DIRTY, DELIBERATE, DANGEROUS move, that's not in the spirit of sportsmanship or racing.
Brown will get what's coming. It wont be from Fonz, he doesn't seem to play that game, he just races. That's why obviously why Brown's pushing him around, he knows he wont get it back the very next time they line up.
I bet Brown can be seen picking on a geek with glasses with 7 of his mates in the parking lot after the race....yep........tough man that Brown.

Posted by: IDkTm---------------------

I agree with TP being a good choice for the MX des Nations, but I also think that he is a huge risk as well. I would say he'll either fly during the race or crash his brains out and put us in a huge hole that Ryno and RC won't be able to dig us out of. I see Brown as being more consistent, plus better suited to a Euro track with his more flowing style that he learned in Europe. Aside from Hnagtown Brown has been very consistent and blazing fast on many occasions. A nice guy? Maybe not, but I have to think that if I was in his position and had his ability anyone in front of me would be a big bullseye. He rides with intensity and is out there to win, not make friends. As far as Leprecauhn Ricky, I like the kid, he's a throwback to the old days of riding hard and training hard. I bet you'll like him more next year XRP when he's riding red.

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by IDkTm
. . . As far as Leprecauhn Ricky, I like the kid, he's a throwback to the old days of riding hard and training hard. I bet you'll like him more next year XRP when he's riding red.

No, even though I ride a Honda, I loathe Team Honda. Too corporate. I do dig LaRocco's Team AmsOil, though.

Posted by: KXKen---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by Okiewan
Did you watch Red Bud? In my book Tortelli and Windham both beat him. Too bad their bikes returned the favor.

Ricky had trouble at Red Bud last year to. For some reason it's not a track he does very well at.

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

Tell that to Kelly Smith a couple years ago. Last lap in a SX, three turns to go and gets taken out by Fonzie over a huge double. That could have been career ending. From that moment on I could not stand Fonzie. Personally, I hope Brown parks the Fonz in every race.

Posted by: Natester---------------------

Unfortunately, your attempt to intellectually entlighten the rest of us has failed again. Fonzie's move on Kelly Smith was a racing accident, Brown's takeout was part of a pattern. :scream: I think you're taking the move on Smith a lot harder than Kelly is. That can't be a healthy thing.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

moto1313

You've got a pretty twisted attitude about the sport. I'm VERY glad you are in the minority. It's not cool, it's not macho, it's just juvenile.

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

First of all, in this post I am in no way trying to attempt to enlighten anyone. You all have your opinions, some good, some not. The 250f is a faster bike than practically all the 125's. Brown's pass, while it can be seen as rough, was about the only way to pass Fonzie. This sport of MX is rough and that is exactly how Brown rides. Did you ever see Hannah ride in the day? I bet you would have hated him back then. Now he is a God to most MX people. As far as being juvenile, well I don't think so. I like Brown's style and feel he is about the best we have in the 125's. Is he a smooth rider? Not a chance. Is he faster than 99% of the others out there? Yes. I am sick and tired of seeing the Nationals look like a parade. Brown mixes it up, passes people and makes watching a race fun. These are the best riders in the world. I watch them so I can see hard riding and what can actually be done on a MX bike. If I wanted to see a bunch of ametures race, I could go to any local race USA. :think

Posted by: Natester---------------------

Whew. Thanks for not trying to attempt to endeavor to enlighten anyone. Funny how knocking down Fonseca is "about the only way to pass" him. If Brown is the premier rider in the class, how come he has trouble getting around those guys on the 250F, yet Pastrana has no problem at all on an underpowered bike? Please turn your intellectual beacon of light my way and explain that to me.

Posted by: SATxMotoX---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by moto1313
The 250f is a faster bike than practically all the 125's.

Then why isn't the 250f at the top of the podium in EVERY race and EVERY moto? With all the monies and technology that the National level pro's have in their bikes, all bike's are just about equal. Sure, every manufacturer is looking for that one competitive edge, and if it helps sell the bikes on Monday, then great. But the fact is that most bikes at that level are on equal ground...it's the RIDERS on those bikes that put them on the podium.

Quote:

Originally posted by moto1313
Is he faster than 99% of the others out there? Yes.

From what I've seen, the pro starting gates are made up of about 10-12 guys that can usually contend for a moto win. Usually there are only about 1/2 that in the running for a title. The remaining 28-30 riders are privateers that are trying to get that full factory ride and are usually in the group referred to as "lap riders". (Now that's not to say they aren't daggone good...they are). Last I saw Brown had 1 overall win and I'm not sure how many moto wins. In my book, that doesn't put him in the top 99% of the faster riders.

Brown's a good rider. He's a fast rider. That was never an issue here. What was an issue was his aggressivness in that turn that wiped Fonzie out. If you slow it down and watch the tape there's a shot that shows from behind them coming down that hill. Fonzie went wide and Brown went inside. Brown cut too close inside Fonzie, hit the gas, and his rear wheel slammed into the entire front of Fonzie's bike (actually hit behind the front wheel toward the radiator). That completely washed out Fonzie's front and took him down.

You are correct that these guys are the best riders in the world and that the competitiveness of their racing is a big reason why so many people enjoy watching the sport. However, I dare say save for a few of you out there, most of us want to watch the comptetitive racing stay CLEAN.

If that were to happen at a local race I'd bet that the person who was taken out would be paying a visit to the offending rider's pits to let him know how he feels about it.

Chris

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

If I wanted to see a bunch of ametures race, I could go to any local race USA

For the style of riding you seem to prefer, that may be the best place to see it. Just watch the typical C class race, you'll see people running into each other, landing on each other and getting hurt all over the place. Whoohoo! Exciting!

Block passing, brake checking, taking a line, rubbing is all fine as far as I'm concerned... T-BONES, slamming and parking people in the bleachers is not sportsmanship... if you can't get around someone with a "clean by MX standards" pass, you must not be fast enough or controlled enough. Resorting to taking someone out because you can't get around them? You have some weak excuses for Brown. It may be that he needs them.

As far as the 250F... funny that Pastrana, who carries a good 30 lbs or so on the typical 125'er, on what may be the slowest ride out there is leading the points.

All the pro's have taken someone out at one point or another... it happens, but when I see someone do it in EVERY RACE THEY ENTER, there is a problem. What happens if he really hurts someone? Think the AMA or the other riders will stand for it? What he does is not "mixing it up and passing people" .

Posted by: Natester---------------------

Amen!

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

This is Brown's first year back on the National scene. Maybe he is a little rough around the edges and he may not be quite used to the other competitors riding styles and what to expect from them (hell I don't know). All that I can tell from watching him is that when he is racing, he is moving toward the front. He is not content to ride around like some sally and accept 4th or 8th place. He goes as fast as he can for two motos and he is great to watch. He is not pretty or well spoken. IMO however, if all the riders rode like this, the Nationals would replace baseball as Americas pass time.

Posted by: Wolf---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by moto1313
IMO however, if all the riders rode like this, the Nationals would replace baseball as Americas pass time.

Ahh,...no Sir, it might replace the WWF.

Posted by: KXKen---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by moto1313
he is great to watch.

I have to agree with that. I was at Red Bud and I think I watched Brown more in the second moto (not first) than I did any other 125 rider.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

I have to agree with that. I was at Red Bud and I think I watched Brown more in the second moto (not first) than I did any other 125 rider.

I'd be watching him too to see if I was going to collect on my pre-race bet that he'll park someone.

Okay! I'll leave it alone now. LOL.

Posted by: KXKen---------------------

I didn't even know that he had a reputation of doing that kind of thing (bumping people off). I was just checking out his aggressive riding style. It impressed the heck out of me. Now that I've read all of these replies I'll be looking for that when I watch Unadilla. Does anybody know if Brown has made any public comments about that Red Bud incident?

Is it just me or does anybody else notice that some of the people that where complaining about riders not being aggessive enough a couple of years ago are know saying that Ricky is "lucky" or "riding on the edge" (like it's a bad thing or something) or Brown is a "dirty rider". Bob H can make comments about knocking people off the track and that's suppose to be cool but Brown does it and it's not?

I'm not trying to say that what Brown did at Red Bud was OK. Maybe I'm just in the mood to stir up trouble today.

Posted by: TwinSpar---------------------

I've been very busy this year and have yet to catch or record a national on TV. I'm missing so much.

Any pictures on the WWW that show the Parking Attendant in action?

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by TwinSpar
. . . the Parking Attendant in action?

I love it! That name oughta stick!

Posted by: TwinSpar---------------------

Posted by: zcookie49---------------------

this holds true for every sport usually. there are always those great athletes that still resort or are noted as being "dirty" Some people unfortunately will do whatever it takes to get them to their selfish goal, which is the reason to race, but it is also to have fun. I agree with the majority here that banging bars and things happen, but when a trend develops to enhighten ones objective and possibly threaten others, that is not good...Its like pitchers throwing deliberately at the head, its like football players grabbing groins at the bottom of the pile.. and you know what happens, fights break out.. is that what we want? do we want wwf crap going on?example-highlights on espn of the fonz going over with some other riders and bumrushing brown? or some derainged fan attacking him for stuff like this? i dont want to see that, i want to see highlights on espn period, the good exposure...
Racing is racing, but you gotta remember if there is no one else to race with, there is no race. Karma usually prevails, and Brown will probably get his, if not on the track, with a reputation... And some may say that they like that kind of racing, do they or do they like Brown and approve of it for they like him... I mean, if you were getting plowed, or T-boned race, then again, it would peeve you to... and you know the other riders know whats going on...Luckily the rest of the riders know what sportsmanship is and hasnt resulted into this WWF action....Just Imagine, Brown going into a berm and getting knocked over by the Yamaha of Troy team... I wouldnt want that. But people supporting riders for their dirty actions and not their abilities have twisted thoughts.... Brown is a very talented rider and doesnt need to do that...How much more does it gain him?
....
And the post about the riders making the outcome over the bike is totally true. there was 10 250f's at budds creek, and only the YOT were really noticeable...the rest being privateers... At the pro level, riders make the difference, 100%...
In my case though, I will take my 250F over my former RM125 any day, any time... later.

Posted by: will pattison---------------------

i saw the move, too, and while i cringed, i'm not assuming brown is a dirty rider as a result. it amazes me that by simply watching an instant replay that so many observers decide that they can read someone's thoughts. the bottom line is, no one will ever know if brown did what he did on purpose. when langston took out bonds at hangtown, the look-back certainly made it appear that it was calculated. THAT'S dirty.

while i'm certainly not as fast as brown, i do know that at times, it's all you can do to get it hauled down in time to avoid disaster, or change directions quickly enough to prevent a crash. it seems like a split second to all of us, but the fact is that if a guy like brown is actually moving twice as fast as you, he really does have very little time to correct. have any of you folks badmouthing him stopped to think that maybe he did the best he could and - unfortunately for fonzie - just came up short??

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

That's a good question. How many that disagree with Brown's move thought Langston's was OK?

They seem the same to me.:think

Posted by: Natester---------------------

As far as Brown is concerned, it's the pattern of taking somebody out every race that I see as a problem. I record them on ESPN2, and he's trying to set some kind of record. I don't know what to say about the Langston vs. Bonds thing, except that he was retaliating for Bonds' dangerous riding. I'm not saying it was the best thing to do, and I don't think he was expecting Bonds to crumple like a Raggedy Ann doll, either.:scream:

Posted by: will pattison---------------------

i've had someone take my front wheel out at 40 mph before, and let me tell you, if you look as good as raggedy anne when it happens, you're lucky!

wp.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

As Natester mentioned, it's a recurring theme with Brown. Every race? He's either dirty or wildly out of control. Which one is better for the riders around him?

Posted by: Boit---------------------

Brown's riding this year reminds me strongly of Vohland year before last when he seemd wildly out of control. Or, was it last year? I'm too old to remember trivial things like which year something in particular happened. At any rate, the incident at Unadilla certainly "appeared" to be intentional, although, that's not for me to judge. If Brown has become the rider he appears to be, he'll quickly become a marked man. I seem to recall an old adage about living by the sword. Since he caught Fonseca, I don't see why he couldn't setup a cleaner passing opportunity since Fonseca was going wide so often? Brown can rail a turn this year better than anyone I've seen.

Posted by: zcookie49---------------------

there is an article in the most recent transworld mx magazine.. i am pretty sure it is the last issue, for i am at work right now and cant verify... anyhow, there are speed and cornering tips by Grant Langston.. Very interesting read considering some have posted him taking out Bonds... The article is basically called "aggresive riding" ... Langston goes on to say that some call him a dirty rider, but then he defines what the difference is between being aggressive and a dirty rider in his opinion... he goes on to say that banging bars and i beleive any impact to front wheels ok.. i do remember reading that he mentioned that t-boning and hitting or taking out anyone at the swingarm is dirty and that he doesnt intentionally do that...
....I didnt see the hit he had with Bonds...
....
I agree with that racing at the speeds these guys do, timing is probably a blur...things happen....but is as Natester and Okie state, that when it is a reacurring issue, every race, that is when people start to talk...
....I will definately be watching this more closely now, as will everyone on this thread and probably all the riders....
... Oh well, we'll see what happens next race!

Posted by: will pattison---------------------

i have only been able to watch 3 or 4 of the races so far. has it literally been every one? if i remember right, at red bud he put on a hell of a ride, and in one moto when he finally got around larry ward - cleanly - he gave him the thumbs up. if that were the only race i saw, i would have said brownie was quite a sportsman.

wp.

Posted by: zcookie49---------------------

I saw him at budds creek and didnt see anything either... well considering the 1st moto he had a 30 second lead.... he blew everyone away... the 2nd moto he passed ward and i didnt observe anything either... so im not aware if it was every race... from what i have seen here, it has been at least 2. on speedvision.com, he comments on the hit with fonzie and said that he was sorry and didnt mean to do it, at red bud, notihing about the next race...
.
that site has all the teams laid out for next year, and i know there is a thread here about rc and honda, but they are posting it point blank now...you might find it an interesting read on where most people are going next year starting off the sx season....

Posted by: Smokin Joe---------------------

That's racing pure and simple. Brownie's obviously riding at a much faster pace and Fonsecrapa needs to either wick it up or get the ell outa ta way! :confused: You newbies outa check into some of the old Hannah duels. He had no qualms about parking any rider he felt was slowin him down. Him and THE MAN, Decoster, had a 2 moto dice during one of the lod Trans-AM races that saw both riders finish with expansion pipes that were smashed flat!

Not to mention the series long death match between Hannah and Howertown in the early '80's!!!! Awesome stuff! If ya think contact shouldn't be a part of MX then go back to cow trailin'. I haven't watched my Red Bud tape yet but I was right at Gravity Cavity at Unadilla and saw Brownie pass the Costa Rican and it was an helluva pass. Fonzacrapa was definitely tryin to hog the track and block Brown's progress so he got what he deserved! He's lucky Brown was nice because Brown coulda really nailed him and sent him 80 feet downhill into the swamp!

Posted by: yarbonwick---------------------

...I drive in GT3. It's always funny when they say waaay after the fact that didn't mean to do and are sorry. Remember when RC hit MC and what happened in the next corner? That's class.

Posted by: JimmyD2---------------------

The race is not over so I guess this isn't really a spoiler...

I'm listening to moto 2 of the Troy race online and Brown and Fonseca are bumping one another big time for the moto lead... This is exciting to listen to - I can't wait to see this one on TV....

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

Amen Smokin' Joe. All this nicey nice, be my friend, in the MX world has me wondering are they racing or should you take a number when it's their turn to pass. When the opening is there, take the spot. Now we find out that Brown won 1-1 this weekend. I hope all you naysayers and panty waists who took shots last week take notice. Brown is the man in 125 MX and should have been the pilot instead of Pastrami in the MXDes. I too look back fondly on the Hannah days of old. When he raced, others racers paid attention. :scream:

Posted by: yarbonwick---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by Truespode

No. That was to prove a point. "Hey MC... I'll beat you in a way that you will have NO excuse!"

He did too.

Actually if memory serves, RC lost that race didn't he?

Posted by: Strick---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by moto1313
Brown is the man in 125 MX :scream:

Then why isn't he the points leader???

Langston missed on FULL race, and HE is still ahead of Brown.

You know, I like the bump and twist racing myself, but Brown is an idiot. Langston also showed his immature side in a race by downing another rider. The next race he blew out his shoulder! Do you believe in Carma>?

Brown will get his, even if he does win the title

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

Brown is only 22 points behind Patrami in the series, 277 to 298. He sits in third place in the points. The best rider does not necessarily win a championship either. Remember Ferry in the 125 SX in '97? No wins, but he was consistent and that got him a #1 plate. He was not the best rider that year. Hopefully Brown will catch up and get the series #1 plate this year.

Posted by: dirt bike dave---------------------

Strick says:
"Langston missed on FULL race, and HE is still ahead of Brown"

Brown got 0 points at Round 2 Hangtown while Langston went 1/1 and TP got 2nd OA, so Brown has had is share of bad luck as well.

I thinks this championship is going to get tighter. I'd love to see an epic final round, three way fight.

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

moto1313,

What do you have against Travis Pastrana? He's going to be the best thing that ever happened to this sport since a certain Mr. McGrath (if he can stay healthy).

The kid is well spoken, just oozes goodness and light, and is an excellent role model for the future generations of moto-stars.

When Mike Brown speaks, I start hearing Waylon Jennings singing the Ballad of the Dukes of Hazzard!

"Just a good ol' boy . . . "

Posted by: Natester---------------------

Moto1313: pantywaists?! Thank goodness nice guys like yourself aren't determining the overall direction of the sport. Sounds like maybe you're trying to make of for a lack of something else by vicariously living through "Good Old Boy" Brownie Scout. :scream:

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Nothing wrong with being a good ole' boy... he can't help it, he's just "agressive". I guess if you were a good rider trying for 10 years to get a 250 ride with no takers, you'd be a little hostile as well?
Brownie is a 125 lifer... Pastrana will have won a 250 Championship and Brown will still be taking out the kids that SHOULD be in the 125 class.

:silly:

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

I don't agree with the idea of putting an age limit on the 125 class. That's what they're thinking of doing over in "FIM-land," and I think it'll kill MX over there (heck, they've dang near destroyed it already with the one-moto formats). I figure anyone and everyone ought to be able to ride 125MX, whether they're 16 or 61.

But, that's just what I think.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

There is no age limit, not saying there should be. But there is a point limit...
The idea is to make sure there is room in the class for the up and comers; cultivate the sport, ya know? It shouldn't be a class of 30 year olds.

Posted by: JimmyD2---------------------

Isn't the point limit for the 125 class only for SX?

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

Far as I know, Jimmy's right. You can win the 125 national championship (outdoors) umpteen times. But you have to "go away" for a while in 125SX if you score more than 100 points 3 years in a row.

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

Geez, I am not trying to make up for a lack of anything by liking Brown as a rider. And no, I do not dictate the direction of the sport. But, I am a fan of a more agressive style of riding AT THE PRO LEVEL. (BTW, Brown went 1-1 last weekend) I have nothing against Travis. He is a very excellent rider. I just happen to like Brown's attitude and riding style. I agree Travis probably is the future of our sport to SOME degree but he is not the Messiah for petes sake. I like his gee golly oh boy attitude as well. But MX is an agressive sport with mostly aggressive riders, and I like that. Boy did I tone this down for old Nate. But I do like a difference of opinion on this site. You guys make it worth while to post a thread.

Posted by: nephron---------------------

XRP said:

Quote:

When Mike Brown speaks, I start hearing Waylon Jennings singing the Ballad of the Dukes of Hazzard!

He can talk? I don't believe it. Show me some proof.:think

Posted by: JimmyD2---------------------

click Brown vs. Fonseca! :D

Posted by: will pattison---------------------

that just looks like two guys who just raced having a good laff. what was really up?

btw, before tallon vohland, who can remember the last american to go euro, then come back and stomp as hard as brownie is doing? i have to respect that...

wp.

Posted by: super rat---------------------

Damn, I missed some good stuff. MX is a head game as much as is it skill and fitness. Brown is sending a message, dont get in that guys way or you will get parked. I love it thats old school MX. Its funny that this Brown bashing thread got started by fonzi getting parked at red bud, look at that tape. Brown ran into the back of fonzi twice in a corner before and fonzi still left the door wide open, can you blame Brown for walking through? I cant, I have seen 125 C guys, hell my wife, has more race savvy. That was just a bad line choice on the fonz's part and he paid. As far as the 125 nationals being for the young guys, thats just crap. 125 nationals are the same as the 250's. Some guys just go better on the 125's, remember Johnny O at the MXdN, is he less of a man because he was on a small bike. You know what the class is called for the up and comers ? B class. You turn pro you race with the big boys, dont like it stay in the B class.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Oh all you macho guys! We're not talking football are we? I give up...let's make MX another WWF show. Done, finished, enjoy your broken backs. forget the ability to go fast! We want blood baybeeeeee.... yes..!

Posted by: Natester---------------------

Yeah, I guess that picture does kind of take the fluff out of things. I like aggressive racing, but the dangerous stuff bothers me. I hear a lot of references to Hannah, and at risk of getting lynched here, I think he was a jackass as well back in the day, no matter what kind of pioneering rider he was. You can't take anything away from Brownie Scout's speed and conditioning, that's for sure.

Posted by: will pattison---------------------

i'm certainly not a fan of bashing as a way of racing, but i think everyone who's bashing mike brown should think a little harder about his position.

his competition already has it made...at a much younger age. pastrana and langston are already full factory riders, and fonzie might as well be, along with wey and ramsey. while brown's ride with pro circuit appears on the surface to be equal to that enjoyed by the yamaha of troy riders, i would bet that they all make a bigger pile of money than he does. they also have more potential years of doing so ahead of them than he does.

as i suggested last night, american riders historically do NOT go to europe, then come back and get a factory ride. by some accounts, brown is an old man, and this is really his last shot at the factory ride that he's been dreaming about since he was riding 80's. i see it as him putting all his heart and effort into it, and while i don't want to see him do it dirty, i gotta say...i'm rooting for him to go all the way. pastrana already has a championship and so does langston - and they will both have more. i just like to see a guy successfully bucking the odds.

wp.

Posted by: MXbabe---------------------

I'm a macho macho man, i want to be a macho man. Hey guys sorry to busrt your bubble but MX is one of the most dangerous sports out there it makes football look like hop scotch. Part of racing is trying to take the other guys line to slow him down or get around, thats all Brown did, if he did'nt make that move he would'nt have been doing his job. TP did the same thing to Ward in the first moto but Ward was smart and saw it coming and did somthing to avoid contact. I cant say the same about Fonzi he looked like a deer caught in the head lights.

Hey Natester have you ever meet Hannah? I was luck to get to take a riding school with Hannah as the teacher, the guy is not a jackass. Maybe you don't like him for what ever reason, your not alone, but dont hide behind your keyboard and take a pot shot at one of the greats in the sport, it makes me wonder who the jackass is.

Posted by: super rat---------------------

sorry thats mine above. I never said i was smart:o

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

Quote:

make that move he would'nt have been doing his job

You've got to be kidding. Have you seen Red Bud?

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by will pattison
btw, before tallon vohland, who can remember the last american to go euro, then come back and stomp as hard as brownie is doing?

Donny Schmidt, for one race at Millville.

I hope he's up there at the great MX track in the sky.

Posted by: Natester---------------------

MXBabe, if telling like I see it about Hannah (IMHO of course) means I'm hiding behind my keyboard, I guess we're all a bunch of wimpering little school girls, eh?

I never said Brittle Bob wasn't one of fastest or greatest.:confused:

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

Hey Nate, speak for yourself about that whimpering behind a keyboard. And about that schoolgirl stuff, Nate stands alone.

Posted by: BunduBasher---------------------

I guess the "A" man is the "Macho Man" after this weekend at Troy, a 1/1 result sure looks good, the point difference in the 125 class is really close now, TP leads Langston by 18, Brown is 17 behind Langston.

There is going to be one big finale to this season.

Posted by: IDkTm---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by BunduBasher
There is going to be one big finale to this season.

I got my money on Langston for that.

Posted by: Natester---------------------

Actually, it's 18 back to Langston, and only 21 back to Brown! That means if Brown were able to win all 8 remaining motos, he would be champion, same for Langston, since the winner picks up 3 pts per moto on 2nd place. Sounds like a barnburner to me. BTW, moto1313, you sure you're not trying to compensate there, you seem a little insecure about stuff like that.

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

Well, maybe a little. But, I'm OK with that. (doing my best Stuart Smalley impersonation)

Posted by: BunduBasher---------------------

I need to put my reading glasses on

125 Point Standing:
1. Travis Pastrana - 298
2. Grant Langston - 280
3. Mike Brown - 277
4. Larry Ward - 226
5. Ernesto Fonseca - 207
6. Brock Sellards - 204
7. Branden Jesseman - 146
8. Damon Huffman - 145
9. Nate Ramsey - 143
10. Kelly Smith - 141

The way Brown is riding, I think he is the man to watch ..... I guess he is still on the "A" list then ?

:think

Posted by: Wolf---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by BunduBasher

The way Brown is riding, I think he is the man to watch ..... I guess he is still on the "A" list then ?

:think

He could be on somebody's "S" list too.

Posted by: super rat---------------------

Sorry nate but calling Bob a jackass while behind your keyboard makes you a nancy. Exchanging ideas and opinions about racing with out taking cheap shots at some one does not make you a school girl. Just my opinion of course

.
I'm sorry if I have caused some confusion by posting under mxbabe, but i never see that i'm on under her name untill i post, what can i say i'm not the sharpest crayon in the box. I have watched the move a few times on tape and Brown did what he gets paid to do, get to front of the pack. Fonzi saw it coming and did nothing to save him self from getting parked. Was it a aggressive move? yes. Dirty? no way.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

If you are talking about the Red Bud move, "i'm not the sharpest crayon in the box" is a massive understatement. :D

Posted by: super rat---------------------

Better be carefull with that sharp wit you might put your eye out:silly:

Posted by: 380EXCman---------------------

I was at Washugal and I have to say Brown was hauling. Nobody could touch him. Langston was a strong second and appeared to be content with taking 2nd place points. (he was putting through the S turn) Probably a smart plan since he has a couple weeks to rest and heal some more.

Now back to brown, He is way faster than Pastrami and should be on the Des' Nations team. TP is quickly becoming "Damaged" goods. And while he is a well rounded Moto guy who could probably excel on anything with 2 wheels he is not the Savior of our sport (we dont need one anyway) and he is not as fast as Dicky Cartright (the Troll as XRP lovingly refers to him) It makes way more since to have Brown on the team than it does TP.

As for Browns Agressivness (for lack of another word) I dont have any problems with it. But I dont want to hear a Troll/MC type whining rant after someone returns the favor. If he can take it as good as he gives it more power to him.

Lastly I would rather hear Brown talking about how purty his cousin is and how the have to haul water to the house from the creek, than to hear TP talking about his first trip to an R rated movie and how much Bubble gum he is gonna buy with his winnings.....

Posted by: SirThumper---------------------

380EXCman, do you actually ride a dirtbike? or do you just sit behind your computer thinking of nasty things to say about the guy's with #1 on their number plate? We all know you favor McGrath any way

Posted by: 380EXCman---------------------

The only guy with a # 1 plate ( err had a # 1 plate) that I cant stand is MC. RC is starting to climb a little farther up my list with his whining.

And as for Pastrami I have nothing against him. My 5 year olkd daughters room looks like a tribute to the kid with TP stuff every where. I just think there is a better 125 rider out there for a position on the Des'Nations team. Or maybe there isnt. I doubt anyone would try to win harder than Pastrana.

Posted by: will pattison---------------------

i'm genuinely interested. what bugs you about mcgrath? who do you like better, and why?

wp.

Posted by: XRpredator---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by 380EXCman
. . . Dicky Cartright (the Troll as XRP lovingly refers to him)

Not Troll, the Leprechaun. Haven't you seen his picture on the boxes of Lucky Charms?

And as far as the MXDN--I think the AMA needs to wait a little longer before they make the decision on the team.

Posted by: 380EXCman---------------------

Doh.....Leprechan is even better.....That whole red green thing.... :confused:

Posted by: Strick---------------------

Husaman, I got to comment on this one. MC & Travis Pastrana have done more for motocross, and its' notoriety than all the other MX riders combined. And yes, the speed of communication we have today has aided this process.

I saw a Motoworld segment a couple of weeks back that asked the question to the viewer, 'What is you favorite motorcycle movie of all times?' The #1 answer - On any Sunday (45%)?), #2 Motocrossed (38%)?). MOTOCROSSED, the Disney movie, that has been out, what, 4 months, was the number 2 favorite, and not that far off from 1!!!! Kids sell motorcycles, and motorcycle racing to kids. Jeremy and Travis have done a real good job of it.

Now back to the topic: I sure hope Brown doesn't get the title, come on Langston (if Pastrana is done).

Posted by: 380EXCman---------------------

I too am rooting for Grant. It started out as KTM thing but now its his toughness... I wouldnt mind seeing Travis pull it out either. No matter how it ends its gonna be a great finish. I see this thing going down to the last lap of the last moto.

Is "Time to Ride" considered a movie? It would get my vote. Im cant wait for part II. (due out Thanksgiving)

Notoriety: as much as I hate to say it Seth Enslow and Carey (Backflip,Ford Ranger sellling) Hart have done alot themselves.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

It's becoming obvious that Mr. 380's list of dislikes is anyone that wins a lot, LOL.

Posted by: Boit---------------------

Yeah. . . plus, 380 likes to rewrite people's names in a thinly disguised attempt at a snippet. Talk about a whiner calling the kettle black.

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

C'mon guys, play nice. Why would you root for Langston? He's a fourener and diiferemt from us. Oh Yeah, he rides a funny named bike too! Go Brown!!!!:D

Posted by: 380EXCman---------------------

Posted by: Strick---------------------

Quote:

Originally posted by moto1313
C'mon guys, play nice. Why would you root for Langston? He's a fourener and diiferemt from us. Oh Yeah, he rides a funny named bike too! Go Brown!!!!:D

Why, because I doubt he is dating his cousin!

Posted by: yarbonwick---------------------

Brown couldn't hang with Langston abroad and he can't here. Let's have someone give Brown a third degree separation and see if he's still in first. Oh and watch for Langston to move up to the 250's while Brown is tackling the 125's with James Stewart. HAHa that would be FUuuuuny.

Posted by: super rat---------------------

Yea Brown should be embarrassed. He is maybe the third fastest 125 rider in the world, what a slug.

Posted by: Byrd Man---------------------

After watching the Troy race, did you guys get a good laugh after Brown won the second moto and tried to high 5 the Fonz? Fonz thought Brown was gonna deck him because of the block pass attempt that failed. I thought it was cool that Brown just wanted to say "hey man great race". The guy evidently lives for this type of aggressive of racing. When Fonz tried the block pass, Brown just pinned it and held on while running into the track banners. It was great to watch.

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

Oh yeah, Brown should be embarrassed for being in the points lead after not getting ANY points for several races and stepping it up and dusting everyone. What do you people have against a guy who is great to watch? He went to Europe last year, lived in a strange land, ate weird food, raced on tracks he had never seen and still had 5 O/A wins on the GP circuit. Don't even try to equate that with Eur'os coming over here either. America is WAY easier to acclamate to the Europe. One language, all the factory support, normal food, easy to get to the races, much freindlier atmosphere. BTW, there is NO way that Langston has a 3rd degree separation. This is a head game to make it seem like Langston is superman or something. A 3rd degree separation is torn ligaments-the bone wouldn't stay in place in other words. Surgery is almost certain for this type injury-I have had it-twice. Brown is about as tough as they come and I think he can handle Langston. As far as Brown being a slug-yeah, great analysis. Fonzie tried to block Brown at Troy, but Brownie just railed the fence and pinned it-you can't block what you can't catch. :think

Posted by: OleDrewBudd---------------------

I don't care about either 1 of these guys, however I like a good fight. After what I seen a Kenworthy's when Fonzey had the chance to Put Brown in the burm, HE DIDN'T! I was suspicious of this before now I'm convinced.

Fonzy is simply scared that Brown WILL KICK HIS ass AFTER THE RACE.

This is Sad, I'd take a good ass beaten anyday if I could have a 125 national moto win.

riding 1 of Gibson's 98 kx250 and having fun.

:confused: :confused: :confused:

Posted by: holyroller1---------------------

I have a feeling that brown isn't the kind of person that would kick Fonz's butt. I think he would congratulate him on a good race, just as he did at Troy. This is just my gut feeling but I think Brown wants it more than anyone else, but I have a feeling he can also take what he dishes out. Of course I could be way off base here.

Posted by: yarbonwick---------------------

Rat and moto you've missed the point as usual. Nobody is saying the Brown was a slug. At least I didn't. Yes he's fast. As fast and any veteran 125 lifer. What is the topic here, which you both have repeatedly have gone off of, is his racing tactic. There is nothing wrong with being an aggressive rider. What is wrong is taking anybody out just because you wish to occupy the same space as he. Or in the case of Red Bud, going way out of the line to take someone out. If Fonz were doing it to him, I'd expect payback. However, both of you need to get the circling stars of Browny off your head long enough to actually see what happens. I know that if you were the one, being t-boned three times in a role, you'd have something to say about it. Then again maybe not, because it would be like, "Browny took me out and over the cliff I went, COOL!" " Can I have him sign my cast please?" Don't get me wrong, I like the fastness of Brown too, but I'm not going to sell my morals just to be his number 1 fan.

Oledrew: that was funny to see Fonz jump off his bike to avoid the hit.

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

Well, I did not miss the point. Superat said Brown was a slug and you said that Langston stomps Brown. Both are absolutely inaccurate statements-PERIOD. Brown has beaten Langston repeatedly for several weeks now and he beat him last year as well. He did not win the GP title obviously, but he did have 5 OA wins last year and all were 1/1's from my understanding. Don't even begin to hand me the shoulder crap about Langston-he MAYBE has a minor injury here. There is NOOOO WAAAAYYYY he has any major problem. Third degree separations are serious-he doesn't have one. Yeah this has gotten off topic a bit, but most long threads like this usually do. You respond to the latest opinion. And as far as it being cool to let Brown take me out to have him saign my cast BS and selling my morals to be a fan-yeah-that's a jackass statement-you're a real thinker yarbo.

Posted by: yarbonwick---------------------

You don't know squat about me. You don't like the thread? Stay out of it. Want to go a round, email me. Browns is fast, Langston does have a major seperation which requires major taping and shot for the pain, Call me a jackass? Does 1313 mean 13 years old or what? For an accountant you seem to really forget to check the numbers before posting them.

Posted by: super rat---------------------

Yarbon, I can tell you are not a mx racer. If you leave the door open some one is going to walk through, thats it. Fonz was begging Brown to park him at Red Bud, he could not have went any wider. I have said this over and over but Fonzi could have let off the gas and saved himself but he did'nt. I love how you take pot shots at the 125 class, who is Jimmie Stewart?
Moto1313, I'm a Brown fan. I'll always cheer for guys who fight to get to the front. I was being sarcastic. I dont think that Langston is lieing about his injury, I just think he is an animal.

Posted by: OleDrewBudd---------------------

Yarbon, Its like if we race at any level and you continue to over cut my slower line (insider burm with the advantage) When it is my turn then I'll deliver the same. Anyhow , wasting time with this now.

Thanks for your reply

98'kx250

Posted by: yarbonwick---------------------

Rat, so let me get this straight being I have my head up my forth point of contact, and can swap flies with a wip of a tail. If you're on a track, and a corner comes up, you or me - a lapper, take the W_i_d_e way around the corner, you have every intention and right to t-bone me off the bike? Maybe we should go riding. Colorado isn't that far. This has been beatin to death and maybe I was a little harsh on the accountant. Brown is fast, Brown is a schmuck, he will get his, end of story. God I hope he goes to 250's.

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

Tell me the numbers I have to check-believe me I would like to know. A shoulder separation that only needs taping and allows you to ride as agressively as it takes at a level that requires any real speed from MY experience is not a 3rd degree separation. The tendons are torn too badly to ride with a 3rd degree. (at least this is my understanding and personal experience). I did not call you a jackass-I said your jackass comments-there is a difference. I stand by that. I think S-Rat has it right. I would be very surprised if, in fact, you do race MX. What Brown does is go forward-we are all witnesses to this. He has added yet another potential winner to the pot every time the 125's line up. He makes watching pretty damn fun. But hey-what do I know-I'm just some geeky little accountant who doesn't know the numbers. Yarbo-as far as personal e-mail-I would rather beef with you in full view of the other members. And if by some chance you make a valid point-hey-nice change of pace. If not, well everyone can take a shot.

Posted by: yarbonwick---------------------

LOL pretty wound up now aren't you. That's good. Now go take a Prozac. :silly: As far as MX-racer, I'm not a steam locomotive engineer either. But I know when you're blowing smoke up my arse- RMDer.

Posted by: super rat---------------------

First off we are not talking about super rat and truespode or yarbon racing in the 30+ class. I am a very clean rider in the 30+ class I almost never make contact. Yarbon if you want too line up I'll be at the Four stroke national at Thunder Valley on the 18th and 19th, come on up it will be fun. Brown did not take out a lapper. I love Browns hard charging style and you saying that i dont get the point of a pointless post is not going to change my opion. If some one is all over your back wheel and you go as wide as posible you are asking for it, fastest line or not. I also like the schmuck statement, I'm sure you know him very well. The guy races dirt bikes for a living, its his career. It's easy for you to sit on your but and say he should have done this or that but untill you walk a mile in his shoes..... Oh, bubba or james, its not too hard to throw me off:o

Posted by: holyroller1---------------------

I also tend to agree with Truespode here.

I really don't think Brown went into the race saying he was going to take out the Fonz.

And you can't really compare taking out a lapper to what Brown did. I to think it was at the least a borderline move.

Who are we to say what was actually going through his head.

Posted by: holeshot---------------------

Here's a pic, for what it's worth...

http://www.motoworld.com/pg/mx/rnd8...ages/troy01.jpg

Posted by: moto1313---------------------

Great reply Yarbo. I like the way you make your point clear. I am not an engineer either, but then i don't give my opinions on it. And I am not wound up, I simply try to give a reasonable basis for every opinion I give. Take a lesson, boy.

Posted by: yarbonwick---------------------

Petulant child, you've dealt with numbers for so long you've seemingly can't make out the letters that formed the words "Want to go a round, email me." Stop wasting Okie's bandwidth with you rhetorical opinions that nobody here cares for except for your one little fan.

Posted by: Okiewan---------------------

round and round we go... where it will stop we DO know!

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That's it. Brown is officially off my "A" list...

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