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CRF 450 for trail riding? or Enduro's
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Posted by: bigboarsrule---------------------
I plan to buy a new bike and would like the light weight of the CRF 450 in the woods, however the electric start of the KTM and now the Yamaha 450's might be better. I have had numerous 4 strokes in the past and know that they can be a pain to start sometimes. (ATK 560, Husky 510, XR500 & XR600, and old KLX250) Any body got woods riding time on the CRF 450?
Posted by: Smitty---------------------
http://dirtrider.net/forums3/search...rder=descending
Here's a search on all the stuff I've posted in Thumper Central about my 450. Alot is regarding Woods setup.
Gotta love the search feature!
Posted by: bigboarsrule---------------------
I'll follow up on your adventures in the woods, did you try the flywheel weight yet?
Posted by: Dan Reed---------------------
Hey Big,
I was just curious, since you've had so many Big "Bore" four strokes, is that where you came up with the name, or are you just a large fellow with an appetite for Pork? Just havin' Fun
Dan
Posted by: Smitty---------------------
No flywheel weight yet. But my new latest and greatest is putting the stock tank back on so I can get forward for turning. Made a HUGE difference for me. To get more gas mileage I tapped the drain holes in each frame spar with a 3/8 brass fitting with a hose barb, then tee'd them together, thru a fuel filter, and tee'd into the main line to the carb. Add a vent line to the top (near the tank bolt) and you've got an extra 2 litres with no obstructions.
For more info and some pics go here:
http://www.thumpertalk.com/bike/ubb...c;f=29;t=001246
Posted by: littlerm---------------------
I have been riding a CRF in the woods for the last year. I have installed a 9 oz. flywheel weight, softer springs, and Race Tech Gold Valves and it is great in the woods. My previous bike was a WR400 and I like the CRF better, mostly because of the weight (or lack of it) and easy starting. The CRF can be made into a great woods bike, but it does take some work. The KTMs are really great woods bikes, and the new WRs should be, too, but both are just a tad heavy. One thing that will hurt the new YZF450 in the woods is the 4-speed transmission.
Roger Little
'02 CRF450
Posted by: bigboarsrule---------------------
thanks Smitty, I need to spend some time talking to you. I just rode a friends EXC 450 and an now torn. We did weigh it with full tank of gas and numerous protective devices and it came in at about 276 pounds. I figure a CRF 450 loaded would be 245-250 with gas and protective devices. I don't mind kick starting at all, that new EXC-450 is pretty nice but I'm still leaning to the CRF. I will want to stay up on what you woodizee riders are doing with the CRF. My handle came from the fact that all in all big bores are morefun to ride forme and a lot less to maintain. Who can hold the throttle open long enough to wear them out.
Posted by: Dan Reed---------------------
Big,
I concur 100% that 4-strokes are great (no pre-mix, no top-end every other week, sound better, torque) and now, finally light(er)!
My next will probably be the CRF also, Good choice & have fun!
Look forward to hearing all the war stories after a full season of CRFs in the woods.
Dan
Posted by: littlerm---------------------
I weighed my CRF with all protective devices and 1 gal. of gas, it weighed in at 244, 1 pound more than a KTM 250 EXC (2-stroke) of similar setup.
Roger Little
'02 CRF450
Posted by: D Lafleur---------------------
DAN, you must be riding an 70s version of a two stroke, I know guys that are getting a full race season on a $200 topend. These new bikes aka KTM 250/300 Gas Gas etc. have way more bottom tourque than the four strokes I have ridden lately. I havent ridden a 03 anything, but I have ridden everything 02 except the Cannondale. As far as sound goes, listen to a well tuned KTM or GG with a good packing versus the rattles of the Yamaha and Honda, and let me know. The stock Jap 4s are way too loud. You cant hardly get the riders attention to let him know you intend to pass. 
By the way the KTM is heavier, but you can only tell that on the scales, riding them versus the Honda in the woods is a way more pleasurable experiance. Now with the mods that are mentioned here, I am sure you can get that Honda and Yamaha(both are mx bikes) to perform in the woods. I just dont understand why someone would spend that much effort and money, when you can just buy one that is ready to go. To each his own, and go out there and enjoy it guys.
See you on the trail.
Posted by: littlerm---------------------
Well, the biggest reason I am on a Honda and not a KTM is that my riding buddy owns a Honda dealership. The other reason I have a converted MXer is that I like to MX about 1-2 times a month. The KTM's probably are better woods bikes, though.
Roger Little
'02 CRF450
Posted by: D Lafleur---------------------
Littlerm, you are one of the guys who have a good reason to be on the Honda, your buddy with the dealership probably makes all the differance in the world. I don't recommend everyone go out and trade their bikes on a KTM or GG, but for offroad out of the box, they are hard to beat. I also have a great KTM dealer here in LA close by and one just 2 hours away, so the support is there. I think your dealer support is just as important as the bike, especially if you are changing brands. My 02 300 is stock with the exception of a custon suspension setup (weight and riding ability) (Cudos to the MXtech bunch, this is a sweet setup),enduro gear, and protective equipment. I also recommend throwing away the factory tires if someone were to buy a KTM, the Bridgestones aren't worth having unless you run in the desert. I also dropped on tooth on the countershaft. That is about it, I also mx and just a twist of the screwdriver and away I go. It is a pretty sweet ride.
See you on the trail.
Posted by: fox13fx---------------------
Hi,
I am a 14 year old off road rider and my uncle just bought a '02 Honda CRF 450R and when he gets it fully modified it is supposed to be the ultimate trail bike. We were looking into the heavier flywheel and also the new REV-LOC clutch. What this does is it makes you not have to use the clutch at all but If you are in a bad situation and you need to use it you can. It is being compared to the clutch less Honda XR 70R. The problem is that it costs $1,000!!!!! If you know of any place that we can look into getting a heavier flywheel please let me know.
thanks
Posted by: Smitty---------------------
Lafleur,
The KTM is a better pure woods machine from the box, but as the trail opens the CRF catches up real quick. I’m a cross-country guy and in our game an MX’r is great. There are plenty of grass tracks, MX tracks, and high speed sand whoops or chop to take advantage of mx traits. I’ll take my CRF in any situation, but it has taken me eight months to really take advantage the whole bike. I also have tried the KTM route (300 MX/C) and did not spend any less to set it up than my CRF. In fact I spent more, I still did tires, tank, bars, damper, seat, suspension, and silencer. Bang for the buck my Honda is working better (for me) than my KTM ever thought about.
So far I’ve only done bars, seat, damper, pegs, tires, and suspension. Three of those are merely size and fit mods. By the way, I can’t agree that the 250/300 KTM/Gas’s are making more bottom end than the 4stks, I’ve owned em and raced em and they just don’t have the torque.
Posted by: Bfaster---------------------
Smitty,
You and I must be riding differant versions of the 2 smoke and 2stroke bikes. I find the Honda doesn't pull until it spins up past 2500-3000 rpm, at which point if you are doing "Eastern Style Enduros" it pulls too hard after that. The Yzs are even later and more abrupt. I talked to a guy today who just rode the YZ450 and he tells me it is way better than the prev. 426. The only Yz that worked better than that, that I have ridden, was Randy Hawkins's 2001 ISDE 426. My 02 KTM 300 EXC will pull the front end off the idle stop, the response is just so much quicker. I run a "gear higher" all the time because of the bottom tourqe. When it gets slick I am usually two higher. By the way previous mx bikes, include red, blue, and green ones. Present include red and orange. I run a 02 450F at the track and I love it. I just can't see myself reconfiguring it for the offroad. I have spent quite a bit of time (500-600 miles) on the KTM 400 EXC offroad, and have wished for more middle power, I understand they got that with the 450 but I haven't had a chance to ride it yet. I know this thread was about the CR 450F, and I have my opinion, being very familiar with that machine and others. The CRF is a fine machine. If what I hear is true about the Yamaha WR and the KTM 450 EXC, these are going to be hard to beat bikes for offroad out of the box also. If I have to kick, I am going to the 2 smoke world, I ll mix the gas and oil, no problem. Either way big boar, you are going to have a hard time picking a bad machine these days. The quality, capability, etc. of the new bikes are at such a high level, it is hard to go wrong. Even the Cdale riders who bought in too early are getting it right from what I hear.
Cheers, didnt mean to run on.
Hope to see you guys on the trail.
:thumb:
Posted by: Bfaster---------------------
Smitty, it is LaFleur as the Bfaster. I meant to say 2 smokes and 4strokes.
My current short term vision is to dual sport a new 450. Just so I can give the local law enforcement guy a headache. His favorite past time is to write the less fortunate a ticket for being on the road, after getting lost in the forest with no appearant options for getting home. Fortunately I haven't had that problem, but I think it would still be a gas, to show him your plate, registration, and endorsement once he has try to cuff you and stuff you.
Cheers
Posted by: Smitty---------------------
Must be a style difference? I've gone down to a 49 rear on my CRF and spend my time in 2nd and 3rd gear when I'm in the trees, when it gets real tight I'll grab first. Maybe I consider the bottom end to be higher in the rev's than you? I don't usually count on having a real usable supply of power at idle, that's not where I need it. Probably a result of our riding areas. We only have a few areas with rocky or root covered hills where you dog paddling and slipping the clutch up a ledge. Most of the challenging obstacles I encounter are taken at speed, different set of bike requirements.
Posted by: DT Rider---------------------
Lafluer,
I rode a 02 Cannondale, I was surprised the model I rode was the Enduro model, and one of the guys I was riding with was on a CRF 450.
The Cannondale ran smoothier and was quietier. In a flat out drag race the two bikes were dead even, and this is their Enduro model.
I like the thrill of the big bore four strokes, but if you ride a lot of tight single track, the big bore will wear you out quickier. I own a 02 250 EXC, and love it, but I will have to admit the Cannondale had some traits that were superior to the KTM. The same day I rode the Cannondale we rode a trail we call the stump trail, my buddy on the 450 got tired and lauched it between a couple of trees, that Honda must of shot 6 feet straight in to the air, when it came down it came straight down on the silencer plugging it full of about 4 inches of dirt. I will agree with the gentlemen that said some of the 2 strokes have more low end than the four strokes, I have ridden several and with the exception of the Cannondale and the CRF 450, I thought they all lacked low end.
Posted by: Bfaster---------------------
DT, that is what I am hearing also, I would like to throw a leg over one of those and give it a whirl, unfortunately for me the local Cdale dealer has won the A** of the century award from most of the off road community here. So there appears to be no one wanting to deal with this guy. Last time I checked he still had the one original Cdale still sitting on the floor. Most of us have been burnt with what he believes is just shrewd business. I didn't mean to get off there. I think Cannondale has made some of the boldest moves in the last few years, and appear to be serious about the market with their replace the original with all the updates. That is some serious commitment. I don't believe you will find anyone else doing this. By the way thanks for confirming what I have been hearing. When I get a chance I will ride one of these.
I also like to play the devil's advocate, I dont make any money in the business, I spend it. So I just like giving other people another viewpoint. On bottom tourqe, with the exception of my XR600(affectionately named tractor) my tourqe bikes have been 2 stroke 300cc bikes. They will rip at the bottom. I agree the CRF450 makes good low power, once you spool it up a little, not like a YZ where you spool it more before it rips out of your hands. I still think the CRF450 pulls a little to abrubtly for technical Enduro type racing. I also have experienced the tiring of the ride. After 4 or 5 hours, I don't want to have to be holding on to these things. Where as with my 02 300 EXC, it comes on smooth early and pulls to the moon. That is a combination of jetting, needle, weight of engine cranckshaft, etc. Different tools for different jobs. You don't see too many formula 1 cars signing up at a Desert Rally. Anyway, Big Boar, it appears that the offroad community has plenty of uses for the CRF and plenty of neat mods. Thumpertalk will take you days to read. And all of you guys, keep up the good work, it is people like us with the passion for not just being content that has made this country what it is today.
Cheers.
Posted by: Smitty---------------------
Just another case of ride what suits you. When/If you come through Oklahoma come jump in with some OCCRA racers and we'll get a ride in. :thumb:
Posted by: Bfaster---------------------
Sounds great, Smitty you guys run any of the BJEC races when they come around?
Posted by: Smitty---------------------
I run the Crosstimbers @ OKC every year and I ran the Golden Eagle @ Stillwater last year. Isn't there one @ Gruber soon?
Posted by: D Lafleur---------------------
Smitty, November 3 is Cross Timbers. This one is just outside of OK City. I wont be there, I have a SERA event at Perry Mountain AL the same day. I have a real good race buddy of mine who will be there, he is on top in the Overall A and 6 or 7th in the Overall for the year. So I am almost positive he will be there. We will all definately be at the Bismark race next June. This is just outside of Hot Springs AR. We plan on doing a few GNCCs next year, I haven't decided what I am going to ride on for those. I am also thinking about running some of the BJEC events when they don't conflict with our SERA events. Keep in touch.
Darin
Posted by: halflife65---------------------
My buddy has been riding a CRF450 for the last year or so. It works alright for the woods, but we ride a lot of terrain that has large rocks and roots. The suspension is much too stiff for that kind of thing (stock), so we're going to see what we can do about it this winter. Otherwise, I think he likes the bike.
I ride an XR, so I don't have the 'too stiff' suspension problem 
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