Deep in thought
- Thread starter michigan
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- #3
Okay, let me rephrase...
If every aspiring young racer had parents that blew thousands of dollars on bikes/gear/traveling expenses and carted them to races every weekend, would the current group of motocross celebrities be blown away? Would Carmichael still dominate? Would he still have a factory ride?
My guess is, our supercross stars wouldn't even make the main! Of all the athletes in the world, only a miniscule percentage have the opportunity to groomed to be a racer throughout their youth. This is unlike basketball, football, baseball, etc., where a kid can hone their skills on a daily basis WITHOUT a massive financial investment.
Seems like theres a direct relationship between how fast a kid rides and how much money their parents spent.
This thought kinda bothers me, and I was just wondering if it bothered anyone else too.
If every aspiring young racer had parents that blew thousands of dollars on bikes/gear/traveling expenses and carted them to races every weekend, would the current group of motocross celebrities be blown away? Would Carmichael still dominate? Would he still have a factory ride?
My guess is, our supercross stars wouldn't even make the main! Of all the athletes in the world, only a miniscule percentage have the opportunity to groomed to be a racer throughout their youth. This is unlike basketball, football, baseball, etc., where a kid can hone their skills on a daily basis WITHOUT a massive financial investment.
Seems like theres a direct relationship between how fast a kid rides and how much money their parents spent.
This thought kinda bothers me, and I was just wondering if it bothered anyone else too.
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truespode
Moderator / Wheelie King
- Jun 30, 1999
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You need to look into the fitness of our top MX stars. There was study done in the 70's and the stars of that time were considered to be in top shape in comparison to Olympic athletes!!!
The money helps them choose the sport but our top athletes in MX would be top athletes in any sport they chose to put in the hard work and dedication to. They have the physical attributes and mental toughness to use all that they have.
The only difference is they chose MX/Enduro/Trials or what-have-you as their prefferred sport.
Ivan
The money helps them choose the sport but our top athletes in MX would be top athletes in any sport they chose to put in the hard work and dedication to. They have the physical attributes and mental toughness to use all that they have.
The only difference is they chose MX/Enduro/Trials or what-have-you as their prefferred sport.
Ivan
- Feb 8, 2000
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Okay, here's my opinion:
It's possible that the sport maybe somewhat more diluted if the opportunity and means where accessible to everyone but I think it still takes a certain someone to achieve what our current SX/MX stars have. You could have handed me, or my parents all the money in the world, but I highly doubt that I would have become an SX superstar. I don’t think money was the only determining factor in their success. I imagine drive, determination, commitment, talent, etc. played a major part. The sport is not for everyone, just like football and basketball is not for everyone.
It's possible that the sport maybe somewhat more diluted if the opportunity and means where accessible to everyone but I think it still takes a certain someone to achieve what our current SX/MX stars have. You could have handed me, or my parents all the money in the world, but I highly doubt that I would have become an SX superstar. I don’t think money was the only determining factor in their success. I imagine drive, determination, commitment, talent, etc. played a major part. The sport is not for everyone, just like football and basketball is not for everyone.
- Thread starter
- #7
All we've proven so far is that given an equal amount of opportunity (buttloads of cash), the mentally and physically superior athlete will be successfull.
And-
Given the same amount of mental and physical ability, the athlete with more opportunity (buttloads of cash) will prevail.
I still think that there are a heckova lot of kids out there that have the "tools", but not the opportunity.
And-
Given the same amount of mental and physical ability, the athlete with more opportunity (buttloads of cash) will prevail.
I still think that there are a heckova lot of kids out there that have the "tools", but not the opportunity.
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- Feb 8, 2000
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Ahhh, I didn't realize you were talking about those with "mental" and "physical" ability. I thought you were talking about the average joe.
- Aug 2, 2000
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Y'know, there may be some unknown speedsters out there, but I look at how well some of the local hotshoes do around here, spanking everyone else out there. Then I see them at a race with all the big guns, and they get lapped!
The pros are the pros for a reason. It ain't all money from ma and pa. Somebody notices them, the industry steps in, and there they go.
The pros are the pros for a reason. It ain't all money from ma and pa. Somebody notices them, the industry steps in, and there they go.
That's the awsome thing about motocross. A good rider will rise to the top even if he or she is not on the best bike. It is the cheapest form of motor racing. It's a blue collar sport. Having said that you still need to get to the big races and have to burn alot of gas to get fast so it takes support. There are alot of guys on the line of a national that come from middle class familes. Look at the starting grid of a F-1 race not to many of those guys come from the middle class.
- Feb 9, 2000
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Sorry Ivan but I gotta disagree with you on a portion of that. Many of our MX hero's are in shape but that does not mean they could play football (too small), basketball (dunk ??), baseball (hit a 95mph fastball at a .300 clip)? I don't think so. I don't believe that any more than thinking that a 250 running back could be an MX star. There are a "few" guys who could play a couple sports but they are normally awesome physical specimens - Size, speed, etc etc. There might be a couple MX guys who could play some other sport at a professional level but I seriously doubt it would be more than 1 or 2 guys. That does not take away anything from the fact that they ARE professional athletes and also in super condition though.
truespode
Moderator / Wheelie King
- Jun 30, 1999
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The point isn't that RC could play center for the Lakers. The point is that he IS a great athlete and he chose MX as his preferred sport instead of a myriad of other sports he could have chosen from.
To assume that basketball, football and baseball are the only alternative sports is unfair and limiting.
There are sports like running, tennis, golf, rock climbing, triathalon, mountain biking, kayaking, skiing, water sports, etc.
If RC didn't want to become a MX star when he was younger and instead put his efforts elsewhere in a sport that was conducive to his physical abilities then he would excel there as well.
Athletes are athletes and do reasonably well in almost any sport. Heck, even Rick Smits (former center for the Indiana Pacers) won a Harescramble a year or so ago (I think Vet B).
Ivan
To assume that basketball, football and baseball are the only alternative sports is unfair and limiting.
There are sports like running, tennis, golf, rock climbing, triathalon, mountain biking, kayaking, skiing, water sports, etc.
If RC didn't want to become a MX star when he was younger and instead put his efforts elsewhere in a sport that was conducive to his physical abilities then he would excel there as well.
Athletes are athletes and do reasonably well in almost any sport. Heck, even Rick Smits (former center for the Indiana Pacers) won a Harescramble a year or so ago (I think Vet B).
Ivan
truespode
Moderator / Wheelie King
- Jun 30, 1999
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Furthermore, the point of the article in the 70's is that MX top athletes are more of a physical specimen than athletes in other sports.
Here is a link to the article: http://www.clishe.com/fitness/fitnessarticle/index.htm
Here is a link to the article: http://www.clishe.com/fitness/fitnessarticle/index.htm
I agree there are alot of kids out there with the ability. But I guarentee you, if someone from a factory sees a kid on a "pretty stock" bike going fast. And finishes in the top 10 or 15 at a amature national. They are going to keep a eye on him or even help him out to see if he improves. Granted, they are not going to do this to everyone who catches their eye. But they know what to look for.
If every rider started out on the same bikes, same tracks, same eqipment, and same amount of riding time. I would put money on it :p , that someone would be faster, money or no money behind them. Money cannot buy a sharper mind to find a better line around the track.
Some of us are determined to race professionally. And that is their destiny. Money helps to get your bike to the track and maintained to go. But that is part of the game. If you can't get to the race because of money problems. That is part of it as well. If your bike is always broke down and your a good rider, and you can't get to the track because of no money. Learn how to ride better so your bike won't be torn up. Yadda Yadda Yaddda.
Here is my take on this.
The riders who KNOW they have what it takes to make it the top. Will get to the top. And they will sacrifice anything they can to get there. And once they finally make it tothe top. They will either be called "Factory" or "Privateer".
Either way. All those guys on the Circuit can ride. :aj:
- Oct 20, 2000
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There has to be some "natural ability" to do well in any chosen sport. I have a co-worker that has and continues to sink thousands of dollars every month into his kids baseball carreer (the kid just turned 16). Now this kid is pretty good but he's not a superstar. Dads money has him on all the select teams he has the time for along with all the persona;l training that money can buy and without all that he would just be another kid on the team. I guarantee that daddy is fullfilling a dream by "making" his kid into a baseball somebody. The fast is the kid goes thru all the motions to become very good at what he does. He has the coordination and has developed the skills to do better than most but if it wasn't for the almost unlimited funding he would suck.
I have never heard of anyone in moto sports excelling without help from Mom & Dad because it's such an expensive sport but I'm sure there are some somewhere. Given all the tools in the world if a person doesn't have the cordination to do this sport he or she will never do well so I think there are many variables to this topic. I agree that MC, RC and the rest would have done well at what ever they chose to do but if they didn't have the support from home (the money) I bet they would have never gotten anywhere in this sport.
my 2 cents!
I have never heard of anyone in moto sports excelling without help from Mom & Dad because it's such an expensive sport but I'm sure there are some somewhere. Given all the tools in the world if a person doesn't have the cordination to do this sport he or she will never do well so I think there are many variables to this topic. I agree that MC, RC and the rest would have done well at what ever they chose to do but if they didn't have the support from home (the money) I bet they would have never gotten anywhere in this sport.
my 2 cents!
truespode
Moderator / Wheelie King
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In this months Dirtrider magazine there is a one page interview with Destry Abbot. He states how he had a tore up bike and helmet and a love for the sport.
John Dowd didn't get factory support until he was in his 20's. He just rode and raced for fun until he realized he could make a living at it.
Kevin Garnett left Mauldin, SC to go to Chicago to play in a good prep school to improve his standings as a high school player coming out for the NBA. He also went to tons of camps, just as many many players in all sports do that make it to the top.
Money helps. There is no question. However, in American sports entertainment money is used in all sports, not just select ones so saying one sport has a higher affluence than another doesn't wash IMO. Golf is expensive and now you are seeing an abundance of lower income families participate.
Basketball is extremely expensive to play if you want to be a "star." The camps cost as much as a good used bike and some kids go to 4 or 5 a year!!! Do you think Mike Dunleavy would be considered a top 10 pick if it wasn't for the opportunity his father gave him with camps and such? Granted his height helped but now that he is tall AND can dribble and shoot he is a top 10 possibility. He would never have made it that far without his work and the camps he did. Or would he?
To say that dirtbike athletes made it b/c of money is to say that Kobe made it b/c of money (he came from a decent income family). I don't buy either of it.
Look at the Alessi brothers who show up with full Honda support yet Bubba would show up with his dad and a pickup. Money is not the deciding factor. Talent, hard work and desire to win is.
Money helps but in todays society if you are good enough and show the talent you will make it. It doesn't really matter what sport.
Ivan
RC may not fair too well when driving the lane against Shaq....but I bet he will look alot better afterwards than Shaq will after his attempt at a 100ft triple! :)
MikeT
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- Jan 17, 2001
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I think it is a natural talent type thing. I can tell just between me and my brother. I would go out and practice whatever it is I was doing and keep it up until I got it. Here comes my brother, Mr. Natural talent and can do it as good or better than I by his second shot at it, then by the tird time he does it, he'll show me up. Drives me nuts :silly: . Guys like RC and MC have that natural talent like my bro times 1000. The talent lets them ride like they do, the physical training they undertake lets them do it for as long as they do. As far as bikes and money, you all know that RC or MC could get a stock CR or YZ and do about as well as they do now. I think if you put Bubba Stewart on a stock KX125 he'd still win. All the work done on pro's bikes makes them nice and all but the rider is what makes them work. Ricky's CR isn't going to make me any faster.
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- #22
True. Ricky could get on a stock cr250 and be just as fast.... because he's spent his life racing motorcycles. And he has spent his life racing motorcycles because his parents spent mucho bucks on him before kawasaki started paying the bill.
Some racers just have more natural talent, desire, quickness, and mental toughness than the other spoiled kids
Some racers just have more natural talent, desire, quickness, and mental toughness than the other spoiled kids
