Tall people jumping

[jarredtaylor]

Hi I'm having major troubles jumping. I'm kinda tall at 6'4", I feel very squirrley in the air. I've observed others and their jumping technique to try to better my own. Problem is, most of the other individuals are quite a bit shorter than myself. I have a hard time "sucking the bike in". I approach jumps standing up, or in the crouched position, chin just over the handlebars, pinching with legs and trying to stay as "loose" as possible. However its quite difficult for me to get lower on the machine than these other guys. My height from hip to top of head has so much of an affect on my stability in the air.. I mean really its like me riding a bmx bike.. its very easy for me to flip over the handlebars, or roll over the back. I'm getting quite discouraged with this, I dont know how to fix it. I almost seem to jump better with my behind on the seat.

For you taller riders.. what kind of body position do you assume at takeoff and in the air?

JT

JT

 

[Anssi]

See "Pari hyppyy"(lavankojump.avi) at my videos page to see me jump an about 40-45 foot tabletop. Try and get some video of yourself, it helps a lot.

I'm 6'4" and have a high seat, tall and forward handlebars.

If you have problems with the video, get Divx ;-) from the bottommost link.

 

[Jamir]

I am 6'2" so I might be able to help. I have just started getting into jumping in the last year. One thing that really helps me is my bar position. I have my bars as far forward as I can. That makes me have to lean more to the front of the bike.


What kind of bike do you have? If you are riding a lighter bike then weight would be just as much of a factor as height.

I have heard of taller guys having their pegs lowered by cutting them and welding them down a little. Personally, I would not mess with this. I am no expert on jumping but I am an expert on learning to jump and jumping badly. Remember to use your brakes and gas.

If you feel like you are going to go over the bars, give it some throttle. If you feel like you are going off the back, give it some brake.

I learned a great technique this weekend. I had one jump that I nearly went over the bars on several times. Finally, I figured out that if I pulled up on the bars right after the take off, it cured that problem. If you learn gas/brake/control you should be fine.....


.....now go take on the day.

 

[Free Style]

Im 6'5" 240lbs. I had problems too. All I can offer is keep practicing, and dont get discouraged...your air sense will come with time.

But know this, if youre tall you will have to work harder at almost everything you do, unless your slam dunking a basketball.

 

[jarredtaylor]

I ride a 02 CRF450R. I have protaper high bends with the adapters. They are very high, they suit me fine. I have the lower IMS pegs with mounts. I also have tall seat foam as well.

I try to jump it like i jump my downhill bike. I come off the lip of something, pull up then push forward and out, sucking up my knees. I use the suspension rebound to help me gain height. I have no problems jumping the mountain bike over 2' plus logs with no jumps.

I dunno what it is about the dirtbike tho. I think because its heavier I cannot point it and really control it like I do with the mountain bike. I get very squirrely in the air, sometimes too far forward or too far backward, even sometimes haning off the side. I tried to do a double a few weeks ago, I landed sideways on the face of the second double and got ejected real quick.

I noticed that some of the smaller riders suck up the bike when they are in the air, and actually hang one foot off the bike.. like off to the side, but not doign a tail whip..

Do you suck the bike in during flight?

JT

 

[Tom Dixon]

I am 6'3" and my DAD even told me I was too tall to jump. My Advise is to find a small table top that will really launch you and hit that until you are comfortable. It took me two weeks at about 4 hours a day just to get comfortable. Just remember that all the ajustments you do are multiplied by your height. Good luck and don't get discouraged!!!

 

[kfrost]

I'm only 5'10 so I can't offer advice to a tall person but I wouldn't let thoughts that tall people can't jump get into my head. To the contrary, I always thought the taller people had an advantage because they have better leverage of the bike. Also, if you have to work harder on jumping I'm pretty sure you can take solace in the fact that whoops should be easier for you because you can allow the bike to work under you better. (Or it seems that way when you watch somebody like Pastrana go through them. He actually looks like he's on a BMX bike as well.)

Also, keep in mind not their's not many individuals in which all aspects of a sport comes easy for them. They overcome with hard work and determination.

Having said all that in hopes of keeping your spirits up, I too had all sorts of problems when I started riding. I wadded in turns, endo'ed over jumps. I stunk at just about all aspects. But I finally went to the Professor and learned what it took to control the bike and the proper techniques and it did wonders for me. So before getting too frustrated and doing something that you shouldn't, you might want to check in to the local schools you have in your area and get a lesson or two. (Trust me it beats the he** of learning through the school of hard knocks.) Also, as somebody mentioned video yourself. Another thing I do is watch riders with the same characteristics as me. So it might be a good idea to get films of other riders of your stature and watch them. Pastrana and Larry Ward are two that come to mind.

Good luck and hang in there.

 

[MX-727]

I'm 6'4" and never thought about my height being a factor. I do use tall seat foam, tall bar mounts and higher bars. I figure with my longer legs, I can suck the bike up further and extend further than short guys. To me, height is an advantage. Look at Travis using those long "shock absorbers" through the whoops.

Squeeze the bike with your knees and use a somewhat natural position when jumping. You can't get as low as shorter guys and if you try, you will force yourself into an unnatural postion that will cause all kinds of problems. At the top of the arc, I like to extend myself so I have full use of my long legs to absorb a landing. Just don't lock your knees (broken fibula). :(

 

[spy-yamaha]

haha man Tom Dixon no offence to your dad but he needs to learn about jumping before he makes a comment like that. Travis Pastrana is 6''2' and has no problems what so ever on a bike. I myself am 6''1' and I dont have any problems. You should watch the Gary Semics videos on jumping. My first time jumping I felt really squirly in the air but who doesn't their first time out. Just try and watch those videos and stay smooth.

 

[Anssi]

Originally posted by Thunder 33

I have heard of taller guys having their pegs lowered by cutting them and welding them down a little.

I think this depends on your bike. On my YZ250, the stock pegs hit the ground in rutted turns so many times that eventually one broke half off landing a jump. If they had been repositioned lower, they would've gotten twice the abuse. Some other bikes might have pegs with better clearance stock.

 

[jarredtaylor]

Thanks for all the info. I'm actually redoing my entire suspension, both front and rear. I spoke with a technician about my problems, he seems to think it's stemming from the CRF's poor suspension. I am having it overhauled.

I'll keep trying until I get it right.

Thanks,

JT

 

[dell30rb]

I'm a shorty, (5foot 5 inches_|) After I get airborne, I sort of do a crouch over the rear fender. I like to take weight off my right leg and let it hang around, its good for controlling yourself in the air. right before landing I stand up.

Just giving you a short man's perspective. Its really all been natural to me. I've never really been uncomfortable in the air

 

[High Lord Gomer]

I try to jump it like i jump my downhill bike.

I think herein lies the problem.

When you jump a pedal bike, you tend to shift your weight rearward for landing because landing is like hitting the brakes. When you land a motorcycle (assuming you have flown correctly), you usually want to get forward so you can land on the gas and accelerate upon landing.

You also want to land with the front tire just a little before the rear so that you can be on the gas when you land instead of waiting for the front to finally slap down from a rear wheel landing. The suspension on the motorcycle is very capable, but it works better if you land on the gas. I'd be really surprised if the CRF's suspension isn't sufficient for you.

 

[JimVowell]

For me the secret was comitting to the jump before I went up the incline. Smooth acceleration off the jump (commit to it) makes flight smooth and enjoyable,also as stated get on the gas before you hit for smooth continuation (unless your looping it (which should not happen if you have not pulled up) lets the bike do the work...practice pratice practice emulate the good riders...good luck

 

[909]

...

im 5'7"... and now i feel like a midget, if you'll excuse me i have to go shave my seat so i can actually tip-toe the ground on my 125

 

[Okiewan]

he seems to think it's stemming from the CRF's poor suspension. I am having it overhauled.

You may want to get another opinion. In fact, please get another opinion. You may need different springs for your weight, but the CRF does NOT have poor suspension. Will a revalve make it better? Possibly, depends on your ability and where/what you ride.

I think I'd spend more time on the bike, get some of the fundamentals down and then think about messing with the suspension. You can bet that the suspension is not your problem with jumping.

 

[jarredtaylor]

Actually according to many sources, suspension is one of the most fundamental elements of the machine. I bought some Gary Semics motocross videos to help me with the basics. I think the root of my problem is stemming from something basic that i'm just not doing.

Im getting used to the four stroke power. I am also expirimenting with how much gas to give it off the lip of jumps, on the face of jumps and howe much preload.

 

[Okiewan]

Actually according to many sources, suspension is one of the most fundamental elements of the machine

No doubt about that. Yes, the stock suspension can be made better. But...Until you move beyond the capabilities of the stock set-up and develop enough skill to notice a difference, save your money. Stock suspension is valved/sprung for intermediate riders in the 170lb range (typically). Until you go beyond the stock set-up's capability, how can you know what you want from your suspension? Are you going to reply on a shop to tell you what you need? I can tell you from experience, a "softer" (ie; stock) suspension is much more forgiving for anyone less than above average skill levels. In general, the faster you are the "stiffer" the suspension will need to be. Have someone like ProCircuit set you up with pro level suspension and you'll hate it.. garanteed (until you turn pro anyway :) )

My long winded point is, unless your skill level is "up there", all of your fundamentals are solid and you feel like the bike is holding you back, spend your time practicing, not spending money :) . A stock CRF is NOT causing you jumping problems. Without practice, gold-plated suspension won't help a bit.

Im getting used to the four stroke power. I am also expirimenting with how much gas to give it off the lip of jumps, on the face of jumps and howe much preload.

Sounds like you're on the right path... add to that, grip the bike with your knees, but stay loose. Keep constant throttle all the way off, don't gas it on the lip. Roll the throttle off when you leave the jump face. The bike will fly level, assuming you are in a natural body position with your head over the bars.

In the first thread, you mentioned wanting to "suck-up" the jump, in the thread above you talk about preload. Those are two different things, bend your knees/arms on a jump face to suck it up (less air), stay "stiff" on the jump face to preload (more air).

 

[nephron]

Ah hell, who needs to practice? Your stock setup sucks. Order a $7000 Ohlins or ProCircuit setup valved for a 300 pounder, sit back until racetime, then take her out and give 'er a try. :aj:

Seriously, I still can't fathom what I'd do with a "better" suspension. What's "better"? Hell, I can't find any fault in what I've got, and I've got one of the "oldest" bikes "still made". :eek: I can't possibly use all of what I've got, or even understand how to use a little of it. I'm still a lernin' fool, and I've been on bikes of one kind or another since I was 5 (call me a slow learner ;) ).

It takes someone like RC to really reserve the right to "demand" his beloved Kayaba setup, or demand Bridgestone 601/602 combo even whilst he's sponsored by Dunlop. :scream:

You, however, have about 10 more years of hard riding before you're ready to start doing anything other than setting clickers.

 

[Okiewan]

Seriously, I still can't fathom what I'd do with a "better" suspension

That statement comes from a lack of experieince :) If you've ever had suspension setup FOR YOU, your skill level and what you ride (woods, MX, SX, etc), you don't know what you're missing. The improvement is not so much with jumping, rather with soaking up bumps, front and rear hooking up better, the front feeling more planted... etc, etc. My point earlier was that until a rider gets some of the basic techniques down, he won't see a real advantage to having the suspension done.

 

[jarredtaylor]

Experiment results. I ordered a Gary Semics video and have been watching how they positon their bodies in the air. One critical mistake i was making was standing up in the air. I am 6'4" so imagine how high my center of gravity was while in the air. I've also been practicing on my downhill mountain bike, and experimenting with preload. I've got my timing down quite well now, I'm ready to start playing on the track.

I have yet to experiment with "rowing" as described in the video.. this is attack position in air, versus rowing back on the seat while landing to keep the center of gravity low on the ground.

I am still very apprehensive about throttle control off the lip of the jump.. and as I read in a Dubach article.. rolling the throttle back as opposed to "chopping" it back.. is essential on a four stroke.

Another bad habit i've developed is while in the air, I tend to not pull the clutch in and let off the gas. I rev the wheel while in the air, and basically control the pitch of the motorcycle by pulling up or pushing down on the handlebars. I've adapted this nasty habit from mountain bike jumping.

I have another habit adapted from mountain biking. When I jump, I compress the suspension.. time it.. pull up on the handlebars... while in mid air and my feet are right above the obstacle, i row the bike forward and "huck" upwards using my feet to ensure the rear wheel has cleared the obstacle. I have clipless pedals so I can real huck the thing up in the air.. I jump shopping carts off of driveway curbs with no problem.
Juming a motocross bike seems different... I Do not have my feet attached to the pegs, but I think that squeezing with my ankles would provide a similar effect.

WHat do you guys think?

JT

 

[Anssi]

Originally posted by jarredtaylor
I Do not have my feet attached to the pegs, but I think that squeezing with my ankles would provide a similar effect.

You weigh maybe 200 lbs? A mountain bike weighs, say, 30 lbs for arguments sake. A four-stroke MX bike weighs maybe 250 lbs.

As you pull either bike up, you also pull yourself down. When you pull up a 30 lbs. bike, it will come up a whole lot more than you will go down(or rather, achieve downward acceleration). When you pull up a 250 lbs. bike, your 200 lbs. body will go down a bit more than the bike comes up.

 

[jarredtaylor]

After much trial and error I think I got the knack for jumping. I was at the track this past weekend, I analyzed how the other riders jumped, and watched some videos. I found a tabletop, and I hit it time and time again until I got it. Then I hit it some more. I finally got the trick down, now i'm working on getting the bike nose high and using the rear brake to bring the wheel back down again. THanks for everyones help.. your reponses were good in both technique and motivation.

JT